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notfound123 View Drop Down
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    Posted: 09/27/2020 at 10:15am
Let's look at the following two blades:

Limba, Ayous, Ayous, Ayous, Limba  (Xiom Off S)
Limba, Limba, Ayous, Limba, Limba (Korbel)

I know one is 6.1mm and the other one 5.9 but let's assume they are the same thickness.

Q1) Based on the composition alone, which one is faster?
Q2) What would be a reasonable step up from Xiom Offensive S, preferably 5+2, that won't be $300/blade as I am gonna need to buy two identical blades. 
 
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SmileTT View Drop Down
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Stan, Ayous is more springy and faster than Limba.  I like ayous it can be used as a singly ply / core, outer veneer, and/or medial veneer. 

If you are looking for 5+2 construction, my recommendation would still be Butterfly. ALC blades' dampening qualities will often produce rebounding frequencies between 1400-1500 Hz, a moderate step up from the blades you listed and personally, my preferred speeds.
Xiom Omega IV Euro | Freitas ALC | Xiom Omega IV Euro
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notfound123 View Drop Down
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Thank you. I think you are spot on. 

Just today I glued my son's rubbers on a spare korbel... and tried both Korbel and Xiom Offensive S side by side, same rubbers on both.  To my surprise the Xiom Offensive S blade ended up being just a tiny bit faster and was more solid overall. Korbel had more flex and was kind of head heavy.

Neither my son nor I liked the setup with Korbel (he's been training w/ these Xiom blades for at least 2 or 3 years). I also removed the rubbers and did a simple bounce test on bare blades. It also confirmed that Korbel was slower (lower tone) and Xiom Off S pitch was higher and felt faster. Don't know the frequencies, just went by sound and feel.  I believe thickness also has a lot to do with it as one is at  6.1mm and the other is 5.9mm.

 
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Yes, for the new plastic ball, blades at least 6.0mm in thickness feels better. It's more solid and stable.
Xiom Omega IV Euro | Freitas ALC | Xiom Omega IV Euro
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doraemon View Drop Down
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Now the problem is Offensive S and Tibhar Stratus Power Wood and also Korbel have the same composition:

limba - limba - ayous - limba - limba

Offensive S (6.1 mm) is faster than Korbel (5.9 mm)

So Offensive S is faster because it is thicker and its head size is 157x150 mm.   Korbel's head size is 158x152 mm, so it is obvious that Korbel will be more head heavy and also a bit more flexible.

Stiga Allround Evolution (6.0 mm) is limba - ayous - ayous - ayous - limba, is a bit thicker than Korbel (by 0.1 mm), but let's say they are the same thickness because of the production variation, and it is obvious Korbel is faster than Stiga Allround Evolution.

I can safely say this because I have Korbel and Allround Evolution with the same weight: 89 grams.

So limba - limba - ayous - limba - limba blade will be faster than limba - ayous - ayous - ayous -  limba blade, given that they are of the same thickness.


Edited by doraemon - 09/28/2020 at 5:32am
Blade : Just wood
FH : black rubber
BH : red rubber
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notfound123 View Drop Down
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Originally posted by doraemon doraemon wrote:


Now the problem is Offensive S and Tibhar Stratus Power Wood and also Korbel have the same composition:

limba - limba - ayous - limba - limba

Offensive S (6.1 mm) is faster than Korbel (5.9 mm)


According to many sources its composition is Limba, Ayous, Ayous, Ayous, Limba. If it's incorrect and is in fact the same as Korbel, it explains everything. 


Edited by notfound123 - 09/28/2020 at 11:25am
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Veet View Drop Down
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Originally posted by notfound123 notfound123 wrote:

Let's look at the following two blades:

Limba, Ayous, Ayous, Ayous, Limba  (Xiom Off S)
Limba, Limba, Ayous, Limba, Limba (Korbel)

I know one is 6.1mm and the other one 5.9 but let's assume they are the same thickness.

Q1) Based on the composition alone, which one is faster?
Q2) What would be a reasonable step up from Xiom Offensive S, preferably 5+2, that won't be $300/blade as I am gonna need to buy two identical blades. 
 

If you want an upgrade with a smilar'ish composition, then I'd recommend Donic Waldner Senso Ultra Carbon (WSUC) ... It's priced well @ around $55

If you don't mind deviating a bit on the wood composition, then I would highly recommend the DHS Hurricane 301. At around $75, it's more expensive than the Donic WSUC, but still, not something you'd have to break the bank for. 


Edited by Veet - 10/02/2020 at 2:47am
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notfound123 View Drop Down
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Originally posted by Veet Veet wrote:

If you want an upgrade with a smilar'ish composition, then I'd recommend Donic Waldner Senso Ultra Carbon (WSUC) ... It's priced well @ around $55

If you don't mind deviating a bit on the wood composition, then I would highly recommend the DHS Hurricane 301. At around $75, it's more expensive than the Donic WSUC, but still, not something you'd have to break the bank for. 

 
Thank you for the recommendation. Not a fan of Donic blades but will definitely consider the 301 blade. The blade(s) would be for my son and most promising juniors of his age have already switched to Carbon so we have to start exploring as well. 
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fmarek View Drop Down
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I always thought limba + limba is faster than limba + ayous. As an example take HL5, even though a sweet spot is enlarged with inner carbon layer it is still slow blade. L + A + alc + A + alc + A + L

Faster 5ply is a blade with spruce, for example ? + spruce + ayous + spruce + ?. You can choose the top ply based on your preferences of crispiness. These may be: limba < walnut < rosewood or wenge. Stiga covers all these: Infinity, Intensity or Nostalgic series with prices more or less sane. I am not bringing Ebony from Stiga into list because despite of similar structure it has a different flexibility characteristics - it does not bend in the center, hence does not "hold" ball on high impact. It is outlier from that line. These are just examples, I am sure you may find copies made by other brands.


Edited by fmarek - 10/02/2020 at 12:01pm
729 Green Goblin 5, FH: 729 Battle II National H39, BH: Palio HK1997 Gold.
DHS Long 5, FH: 729 Battle II Gold H40, BH: Nittaku C1
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Veet View Drop Down
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Originally posted by notfound123 notfound123 wrote:


 
Thank you for the recommendation. Not a fan of Donic blades but will definitely consider the 301 blade. The blade(s) would be for my son and most promising juniors of his age have already switched to Carbon so we have to start exploring as well. 

Oh, I quite like Donic Blades - Donic Persson Carbotec, Donic Defplay Senso, Donic WSUC .. I like all these... Any particular reason(s) why you're not a fan of Donic blades ? 

Another option for a first-time carbon blade would be Stiga Offensive Classic Carbon 




Edited by Veet - 10/02/2020 at 12:31pm
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TT newbie View Drop Down
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Originally posted by notfound123 notfound123 wrote:

Q2) What would be a reasonable step up from Xiom Offensive S, preferably 5+2, that won't be $300/blade as I am gonna need to buy two identical blades.

The immediate upgrade of 5-ply limba - aaa - limba  blade is a 7-ply blade with same construction.
Clipper is made of limba - aaaaa - limba. However Clipper has 6.7mm and it might be too fast and hard for a 5-ply blade user.



Edited by TT newbie - 10/03/2020 at 1:19am
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Originally posted by TT newbie TT newbie wrote:

The immediate upgrade of 5-ply limba - aaa - limba  blade is a 7-ply blade with same construction.
Clipper is made of limba - aaaaa - limba. However Clipper has 6.7mm and it might be too fast and hard for a 5-ply blade user.

There's no hard-n-fast rule that The immediate upgrade of 5-ply limba - aaa - limba  blade is a 7-ply blade with same construction. .. It'd depends on how your game is .. I know plenty of players who've played with a Stiga Allround Classic (5ply Limba AAA Limba) for 2 years or so, and then upgraded to some Carbon-composite blade.. 

That being said, Stiga Clipper is one of my favs.. If you're looking for a fast all-wood blade, then it'd be one  of my recommendations...  

The 7-ply Limba-Ayous-Ayous-Ayous-Ayous-Ayous-Limba blade is produced by every blade manufacturer worth his salt.. Huaruite makes an exact replica of the Clipper, and it costs a fraction. 


Edited by Veet - 10/03/2020 at 2:14am
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