Alex Table Tennis - MyTableTennis.NET Homepage
  Help Desk Help Desk  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Chinese forehand Vs. Euro forehand?
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

Chinese forehand Vs. Euro forehand?

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1 34567 16>
Author
Baal View Drop Down
Forum Moderator
Forum Moderator


Joined: 01/21/2010
Location: unknown
Status: Offline
Points: 13940
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03/14/2010 at 6:30am
So, to people who have tried to make a change, how dependent is that stroke style on using a particular type of rubber?  I have wondered about this recently, I have a new occasional practice partner who used to be on a province junior team in Fujian province, and I marvel at the power and spin he has on his very Chinese forehand. It really blows my mind.   
Back to Top
Sponsored Links


Back to Top
dragon kid View Drop Down
Premier Member
Premier Member
Avatar

Joined: 07/28/2007
Status: Offline
Points: 3005
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dragon kid Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03/14/2010 at 7:24am
Originally posted by icontek icontek wrote:

Originally posted by APW46 APW46 wrote:

I honestly think that the perspective that players/members of this forum look at this, is directly associated to their level of play, I'm saying no more on this, other than that there are many levels of standards between WLC etc, and the players/members of this forum post their views accordingly, my personal view, as a coach that specialises in improving the standard of players who are not potential internationals, are not ever going to reach the heights of International play, do not practice full time, are not sponsored, Are not a part of an international program for producing top players, do not have the time, money or inclination to play at the top level, Are well above the age at which any of the above is realistically possible, but just wish to be a little better in their play, Leave this stuff alone, be honest about your realistic expectations, don't try to copy WLC's F/hand drive, develop your own, personal to you, copy the best player in your club, its a realistic goal that you can achieve, trying to emulate the best players in the world is just not a realistic propasition, there are for the most of us, players who are the stars of our regions/ countries who are full time proffesional players, yet they cannot get anywhere near the level of the best players in the world, do you not think that they might have possibly been advised by their national full time experienced coaches on the benefits, realisations and probabilities of success that they can apparently easily achieve by copying WLC and the rest of the current Chinese national team? So why does anyone on this forum think that the advice given by blahness is going to make any difference to their game? we in England send our best players to China for long periods, they do not ever come back having a WLC forhand, why does anyone think that they can employ these methods better than them? that is why I was quite precise in my response with the word 'Bullsh*t' and I whole heartedly stick by it.
 When it comes to coaching, In am seriously a massive critic, there is an obvious culture within the USA of Chinese coaches being resident in clubs of a given locality. For the most part, the techniques and stratergies of these coaches is well above what the players they coach are capable of, they are there for money and money alone, and are not capable of coaching anything other than international play, which flies well above the capabilities of most of their students. So what i'm saying guys is that if you wish to get that edge, that extra bump up the ratings next year, you would be far better off following Brian Pace than a top Chinese coach. If however you are ranked 120 in the world, go for the Chinese guy every timeWink
 
 
man there is some good stuff in that post.
 
a good coach knows how to point out the little things that make a big difference in power and effect of stroke production. a better coach knows how to point out little things that are truly game changing (at your level) and fundamentally improve your situational awareness and response.
 
p.s.
thanks for the stroke recovery comment earlier via pm, when i do it, it changes *EVERYTHING*. in drilling, it increases consistency and control. in games it improves readiness and shot selection. thank you.


Well, you cannot expect to have WLQ's FH if you don't have the talent, and no, not even the most talented younger Chinese players have it, and not the England players also it seems.. He is a special player, that is why he is the player I admire the most
Back when he was on the top form of his career, nobody can contain WLQ's FH..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=01yTWPVUOmk&feature=related

This clip has some great WLQ's moment

655H3PClassicAcudaS1
'Nobody is Perfect. I am Nobody'
Back to Top
vali View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member
Avatar

Joined: 11/30/2007
Location: Romania
Status: Offline
Points: 135
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote vali Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03/18/2010 at 8:16am
Originally posted by Rack Rack wrote:

I use to think the same way about Chinese rubber and just "grazing" with the topsheet before I started getting coaching... turns out thats completely wrong.  You must hit hard enough to penetrate into the hard sponge and use the sponge and topsheet together.  When done in harmony, you hit in the ball into the sponge at 80-90 degrees and begin to naturally followthrough which closes your blade along with some wrist movement.  The tack will cause the ball to stick or "dwell" as your blade closes and there enlies the high control factor.  Then you catapult the ball forward to where you wanna go.  Basic simple description Chinese stroke loop vs no spin.  Of course theres much more to the stroke as well but it would take ages to describe.  But i'll tell you one thing... once you figure it out... you'll know the true power of Chinese rubbers.  Massive spin, massive speed, minimal power output from you.


Great post ! This is 100% true.
Clipper
FH: XIOM Vega Asia , max
BH: Yasaka RAKZA7, 2.0
Back to Top
vali View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member
Avatar

Joined: 11/30/2007
Location: Romania
Status: Offline
Points: 135
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote vali Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03/18/2010 at 8:21am
And another thing : there is no euro , or chinese style .Straight arm loop is just the forehand loop "by the book". Any old coach will teach you that. I dare to say that the speed glue era changed that into a shorter stroke.
Just look at Jonyer . What style is it ?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Os4Y_wadG-o
Clipper
FH: XIOM Vega Asia , max
BH: Yasaka RAKZA7, 2.0
Back to Top
theman View Drop Down
Premier Member
Premier Member
Avatar

Joined: 09/22/2006
Location: Australia
Status: Offline
Points: 7323
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote theman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03/18/2010 at 9:09am
i too have always thought the hungarians had monstrous technique on the forehand. to me, they were the ones who really pioneered the "straight arm" loop,

pure pleasure!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Gq9ox81J_o&feature=related
i lost my racquet

Schlager u beast

http://www.youtube.com/MDSguy

Back to Top
keven702 View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member
Avatar

Joined: 07/01/2009
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 167
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote keven702 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/07/2010 at 12:23pm
I'm only a beginner in TT but I understand momentum and the mechanics of

the human body well. For a good powerful straight-arm with a chinese rubber

 is to turn your feet and waist first (remember keep your head still and on the

 ball and knees should be bent like normal ) then cock back your swinging

arm then pull back your shoulders so your chest is popping outwards

(remember to keep your arms loose ) then starting from the feet up

everything should unwind like if you twisted a rubberband and let go. The

 momentum should make your arm come up half-way and the rest of the

 momentum should come out of your shoulders and that will forst the rest

 of your arm though and on the the ball and your wrist should snap

automatically but you can be more agrssive with the wrist if you are able

to control the ball. REMEMBER the whole time your arm should be relaxed

only your shoulders might feel the tension. THis way all the momentum is

nevered stop and also provides good power and good timing . If you

tighten your arm the momentum will stop or wont be as much and your

timing will be off and the shot will be inaccurate or as powerful.


I liked to compare this like chinese kungfu and linking momentum your body .

Think of it like this all your power comes from the ground up.


Think about punching something or someone while sitting in a wheelchair (or in outerspace to be more dramatic)

 you would barely have any power because you are only using your arm

and the mass of it your muscles will only be able to effect the speed of

 your arm. But if you punch some one stand up on a concrete floor you

would be able to utilized your body wieght and the wieght of the ground .


Like i said im only a beginner in tabletennis so this might be BS hahaLOL
but it works for me Wink
Back to Top
jkillashark View Drop Down
Silver Member
Silver Member
Avatar

Joined: 03/14/2007
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 560
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jkillashark Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/07/2010 at 12:26pm
European is clearly inferior. Chinese is more demanding though.
www.teamliquid.net
Nittaku Violin FL
FH: Black DHS Neo Hurricane 3 Orange Sponge Provincial Max
BH: Red Xiom Vega Europe Max

Screw Butterfly and go Korean.
Footwork and forehand is always the answer.
Back to Top
Rack View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member
Avatar

Joined: 07/13/2008
Location: USA
Status: Offline
Points: 1145
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rack Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/07/2010 at 1:53pm
The European FH can be just as devastating as the Chinese FH.  Both ways can work just as well and take you to a very high level.  In the end, both paths pretty much take you to the same place.  It's just which fits you more and what you use... kinda like Shakehand vs Penholds.  Some naturally would hold the blade shakehand and some naturally hold it penhold but both paths can lead you to be a very good player.
Yasaka Ma Lin YEO (1st) , Yasaka Extra CPEN (2nd)

FH - H3 NEO Pro 2.15 40H

BH - Tenergy 64 2.1
Back to Top
Magyar View Drop Down
Member
Member


Joined: 05/02/2010
Status: Offline
Points: 29
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Magyar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/03/2010 at 11:09am
There is no such thing a Euro forehand.
 
There is two basic versions of the forehand topspin stroke; the chinese and the hungarian.
Back to Top
icontek View Drop Down
Premier Member
Premier Member
Avatar
This is FPS Doug

Joined: 10/31/2006
Location: Maine, US
Status: Offline
Points: 5169
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote icontek Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/04/2010 at 12:19pm
Originally posted by Magyar Magyar wrote:

There is no such thing a Euro forehand.
 
There is two basic versions of the forehand topspin stroke; the chinese and the hungarian.
 
 
??
US1260.RC1042 . Avalox P500 : Tuple 007 Pro + Victas 402DE
Back to Top
miththu View Drop Down
Member
Member


Joined: 05/04/2010
Status: Offline
Points: 4
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote miththu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/04/2010 at 12:40pm
Are there any specific things about the 'Chinese' technique that make it more difficult to play against?  To me it seems like the Chinese have developed  better over the table and counter driving game, where the Europeans like to play from several meters back. 
Back to Top
Magyar View Drop Down
Member
Member


Joined: 05/02/2010
Status: Offline
Points: 29
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Magyar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/04/2010 at 12:54pm
I don't understand??
Back to Top
Baal View Drop Down
Forum Moderator
Forum Moderator


Joined: 01/21/2010
Location: unknown
Status: Offline
Points: 13940
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/04/2010 at 2:34pm
I always thought Zhang Jike's forehand looks like Klampar (one of my heroes as a kid). 

So I guess what people are saying is that in some sense, the old Hungarian forehand is in many ways similar to what people now call a Chinese forehand loop, and different looking from loops of, say, Maze, Ovtcharov, Korbel, Persson.
Back to Top
icontek View Drop Down
Premier Member
Premier Member
Avatar
This is FPS Doug

Joined: 10/31/2006
Location: Maine, US
Status: Offline
Points: 5169
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote icontek Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/04/2010 at 3:51pm
Originally posted by icontek icontek wrote:

Originally posted by Magyar Magyar wrote:

There is no such thing a Euro forehand.
 
There is two basic versions of the forehand topspin stroke; the chinese and the hungarian.
 
 
??


The current Chinese topspin (as opposed to the 80's Chinese Flat Hit) is an evolution of the Hungarian Topspin that predates speed glue.

The so called "euro loop" that is still in use across the continent is a stroke that was refined by the Swedes while using tire glue.




US1260.RC1042 . Avalox P500 : Tuple 007 Pro + Victas 402DE
Back to Top
APW46 View Drop Down
Assistant Moderator
Assistant Moderator
Avatar

Joined: 02/02/2009
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 3395
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote APW46 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/04/2010 at 4:33pm
Originally posted by Magyar Magyar wrote:

I don't understand??
 Obviously. You are a pretty flawed guy.
 I think its time for the Mods to think with their heads.
 Its always a give away when the posts are never longer than one or two sentences, and never with an explanation, Its what we all would do if we were pretending to be something we were not, ie, the less you say, the less you give away.... 
The Older I get, The better I was.
Back to Top
Baal View Drop Down
Forum Moderator
Forum Moderator


Joined: 01/21/2010
Location: unknown
Status: Offline
Points: 13940
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/05/2010 at 12:37am
Originally posted by APW46 APW46 wrote:

Originally posted by Magyar Magyar wrote:

I don't understand??
 Obviously. You are a pretty flawed guy.
 I think its time for the Mods to think with their heads.
 Its always a give away when the posts are never longer than one or two sentences, and never with an explanation, Its what we all would do if we were pretending to be something we were not, ie, the less you say, the less you give away.... 


+1
Back to Top
walleyeguy7 View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: 12/11/2009
Location: Paducah, KY
Status: Offline
Points: 417
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote walleyeguy7 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05/12/2010 at 5:36pm
people tend to make this issue into a big deal when it is not. to me there is no european stroke vs chinese stroke, there is only european style, japanese style, and chinese style rubber. you naturally adjust your stroke accordingly to get the same results. i started with iqul on my forehand and after a few months decided to try h3 neo simply because my whole club is chinese and half of them use hurricane variants. the first thing i noticed in switching was the amazing control h3 allows, but to get the same speed and spin you get from eurojap rubber you simply have to hit with much more power. i had no coaching at the time, and i just adjusted naturally. neither way is better or even different per say, its just a preference in forehand rubbers. i doubt euro style rubber dictates any back problems that chinese rubbers dont.
Back to Top
richrf View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member


Joined: 06/02/2009
Location: Stamford
Status: Offline
Points: 1531
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote richrf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06/27/2010 at 11:46am
I think where the Chinese excel is in their food work and body conditioning including very a relaxed, flexible body structure which comes from proper attention stretching and workouts. Their paddles are extensions of their whip-like body structures. Compare to the stiff bodies of most players including myself. Building a whip requires relaxation and inner confidence that comes with thousands of hours of practice that focuses on the image of hitting the ball instead of mechanics. 

BTW, here is a vid of Stellan Bengtsson, who helped refashion the modern shake hand style so that it would be competitive against the penholder:


Back to Top
mon22 View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member
Avatar

Joined: 03/05/2010
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 1033
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mon22 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/03/2010 at 7:31pm
I have focused on switching my FH and extensively tried to emulate a chinese FH.  So far i am more consistent and have less shoulder problems. 
 
Since i have changed i have won my first TT tournament under 1100.  Many believed that i am completely under rated due to my consistency in my fh stroke.  One even asked me if i was chinese lOl LOL
 
It is not completely perfect but i am still focused on getting there. 
BTw on my struggle, it was really hard to hit the ball with a straight arm thus forcing me to move my feet and it improved my footwork as well.  Supporting the point that it is very demanding(but very rewarding).
I am a total Newb. Come at me!
Back to Top
takaaki View Drop Down
Premier Member
Premier Member


Joined: 05/07/2006
Status: Offline
Points: 3107
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote takaaki Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/03/2010 at 9:39pm
BANNED
Back to Top
stiltt View Drop Down
Forum Moderator
Forum Moderator
Avatar

Joined: 07/15/2007
Location: USA
Status: Offline
Points: 16926
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stiltt Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/04/2010 at 11:16pm
link fixed :)
Back to Top
ohhgourami View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar

Joined: 08/12/2008
Location: SoCal
Status: Offline
Points: 2373
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ohhgourami Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/05/2010 at 12:08am
Motion is completely correct.  I just don't like his extra wrist motion at the start of his swing though.  No real point to it and might throw people off when trying to learn.
Custom Walnut 7-ply
DHS H3 Provincial untuned 40°
BTY T64
210g
Back to Top
racquetsforsale View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member


Joined: 10/02/2010
Location: at the table
Status: Offline
Points: 1279
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote racquetsforsale Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/03/2010 at 10:16pm
Originally posted by Rack Rack wrote:

 
...you hit in the ball into the sponge at 80-90 degrees and begin to naturally followthrough which closes your blade along with some wrist movement.  The tack will cause the ball to stick or "dwell" as your blade closes and there enlies the high control factor.  Then you catapult the ball forward to where you wanna go.  Basic simple description Chinese stroke loop vs no spin.  Of course theres much more to the stroke as well but it would take ages to describe.  But i'll tell you one thing... once you figure it out... you'll know the true power of Chinese rubbers.  Massive spin, massive speed, minimal power output from you.



Has anyone seen super high speed footage (1000+ fps) confirming this technique of closing the blade during contact is even humanly possible? From a physiologic perspective, there just isn't enough time for the electrical signal registering the contact to travel from the hand to the brain and then for the brain to process it and send one back to the hand stimulating it to close the blade. The sensation of proactively closing the blade registers only long after the ball has left the blade.

I believe what the Chinese coaches are describing is what it should FEEL like executing the stroke, but not what actually needs to happen or does happen between blade and ball. In other words, the sensation of closing the blade may be essential in causing the blade to move a certain way, but what actually happens is that either the blade has already begun closing from its initial 80-90 degree angle prior to contact and thus contacts the ball at a smaller angle, or the blade actually contacts  the ball while it's still angled at 80-90 degrees. Even if one were to began closing the blade before contact and continues to do so during and after contact, it's humanly impossible to execute that fast enough to have any effect on the ball. We just cannot proactively operate at such a small time scale.
Back to Top
Baal View Drop Down
Forum Moderator
Forum Moderator


Joined: 01/21/2010
Location: unknown
Status: Offline
Points: 13940
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/03/2010 at 10:46pm
Originally posted by racquetsforsale racquetsforsale wrote:



Has anyone seen super high speed footage (1000+ fps) confirming this technique of closing the blade during contact is even humanly possible? From a physiologic perspective, there just isn't enough time for the electrical signal registering the contact to travel from the hand to the brain and then for the brain to process it and send one back to the hand stimulating it to close the blade. The sensation of proactively closing the blade registers only long after the ball has left the blade.

I believe what the Chinese coaches are describing is what it should FEEL like executing the stroke, but not what actually needs to happen or does happen between blade and ball. In other words, the sensation of closing the blade may be essential in causing the blade to move a certain way, but what actually happens is that either the blade has already begun closing from its initial 80-90 degree angle prior to contact and thus contacts the ball at a smaller angle, or the blade actually contacts  the ball while it's still angled at 80-90 degrees. Even if one were to began closing the blade before contact and continues to do so during and after contact, it's humanly impossible to execute that fast enough to have any effect on the ball. We just cannot proactively operate at such a small time scale.


Very interesting and perceptive. 
Back to Top
racquetsforsale View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member


Joined: 10/02/2010
Location: at the table
Status: Offline
Points: 1279
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote racquetsforsale Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/03/2010 at 11:03pm
Originally posted by APW46 APW46 wrote:

I honestly think that the perspective that players/members of this forum look at this, is directly associated to their level of play, I'm saying no more on this, other than that there are many levels of standards between WLC etc, and the players/members of this forum post their views accordingly, my personal view, as a coach that specialises in improving the standard of players who are not potential internationals, are not ever going to reach the heights of International play, do not practice full time, are not sponsored, Are not a part of an international program for producing top players, do not have the time, money or inclination to play at the top level, Are well above the age at which any of the above is realistically possible, but just wish to be a little better in their play, Leave this stuff alone, be honest about your realistic expectations, don't try to copy WLC's F/hand drive, develop your own, personal to you, copy the best player in your club, its a realistic goal that you can achieve, trying to emulate the best players in the world is just not a realistic propasition, there are for the most of us, players who are the stars of our regions/ countries who are full time proffesional players, yet they cannot get anywhere near the level of the best players in the world, do you not think that they might have possibly been advised by their national full time experienced coaches on the benefits, realisations and probabilities of success that they can apparently easily achieve by copying WLC and the rest of the current Chinese national team? So why does anyone on this forum think that the advice given by blahness is going to make any difference to their game? we in England send our best players to China for long periods, they do not ever come back having a WLC forhand, why does anyone think that they can employ these methods better than them? that is why I was quite precise in my response with the word 'Bullsh*t' and I whole heartedly stick by it.
 When it comes to coaching, In am seriously a massive critic, there is an obvious culture within the USA of Chinese coaches being resident in clubs of a given locality. For the most part, the techniques and stratergies of these coaches is well above what the players they coach are capable of, they are there for money and money alone, and are not capable of coaching anything other than international play, which flies well above the capabilities of most of their students. So what i'm saying guys is that if you wish to get that edge, that extra bump up the ratings next year, you would be far better off following Brian Pace than a top Chinese coach. If however you are ranked 120 in the world, go for the Chinese guy every timeWink


Well said, sir. Clap

You know, the same thing has been happening over on the tennis forums with all sorts of people giving and taking advice about how to hit FHs like Roger Federer or Rafael Nadal or serve like the great Pete Sampras. LOL

But I will say this, there is value to observing the pros' mechanics beyond the core fundamentals. Some things that pros are doing, regardless of whether they are aware of them or not, which are often labeled as part of their "talent" by coaches, can actually be taught and learned through targeted training.

I don't know enough about TT to give examples, but I'm also a tennis player and I can give an example in tennis: pronation, as it's used for the tennis serve. If you don't know what it is, do a Google search and you find tons about it. It's a common element found in the throwing motion as well. Badminton players, you know what I'm talking about. Anyways, for the longest time, pronation was not taught or was described and demonstrated incorrectly by coaches to the general lesson-seeking public. As a result, there was a very large gap in serve velocity between the pro level and the amateur level. Today, any good tennis coach will incorporate pronation into his curriculum because it will allow his students to develop their full serving potential. Now, just getting pronation down will not yield a world class tennis serve which is built on other intangibles like flexibility, strength, speed, and coordination, qualities which a student simply cannot just emulate. No tennis player should think he can serve like Sampras because he can pronate just like him. APW46 speaks to this effect regarding TT and I agree.
Back to Top
beeray1 View Drop Down
Premier Member
Premier Member
Avatar

Joined: 07/03/2008
Location: Iowa
Status: Offline
Points: 5232
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote beeray1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/04/2010 at 4:23pm
APW, i wish you could be my coach :)
Nostalgic Offensive
EL-S
Vega Japan
Back to Top
friendship View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: 09/03/2010
Status: Offline
Points: 452
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote friendship Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/05/2010 at 3:55am
Originally posted by racquetsforsale racquetsforsale wrote:

Has anyone seen super high speed footage (1000+ fps) confirming this technique of closing the blade during contact is even humanly possible? From a physiologic perspective, there just isn't enough time for the electrical signal registering the contact to travel from the hand to the brain and then for the brain to process it and send one back to the hand stimulating it to close the blade. The sensation of proactively closing the blade registers only long after the ball has left the blade.

I believe what the Chinese coaches are describing is what it should FEEL like executing the stroke, but not what actually needs to happen or does happen between blade and ball. In other words, the sensation of closing the blade may be essential in causing the blade to move a certain way, but what actually happens is that either the blade has already begun closing from its initial 80-90 degree angle prior to contact and thus contacts the ball at a smaller angle, or the blade actually contacts  the ball while it's still angled at 80-90 degrees. Even if one were to began closing the blade before contact and continues to do so during and after contact, it's humanly impossible to execute that fast enough to have any effect on the ball. We just cannot proactively operate at such a small time scale.
 
depending on setup. if you deal with soft, not too springy sponge, dwell time is huge and I think you actually have the time to change the angle a little during the time when ball rests in sponge. with some rubber (729 focus 3 is such) you can actually feel timing while ball is in sponge
Back to Top
friendship View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: 09/03/2010
Status: Offline
Points: 452
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote friendship Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/05/2010 at 4:05am
Originally posted by ohhgourami ohhgourami wrote:

Motion is completely correct.  I just don't like his extra wrist motion at the start of his swing though.  No real point to it and might throw people off when trying to learn.
 
wrist may get some extra speed together with present spin, but makes the motion complicated. seems like something player may try to add to his motion not before stroke is completely adopted, consistent and natural, before that even trying would certainly not be good idea
Back to Top
racquetsforsale View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member


Joined: 10/02/2010
Location: at the table
Status: Offline
Points: 1279
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote racquetsforsale Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/05/2010 at 11:27am
Originally posted by friendship friendship wrote:

 
depending on setup. if you deal with soft, not too springy sponge, dwell time is huge and I think you actually have the time to change the angle a little during the time when ball rests in sponge. with some rubber (729 focus 3 is such) you can actually feel timing while ball is in sponge


As I mentioned before, our feeling/sensation may be misleading. Only high speed footage (1000 fps+) can prove or disprove the paddle-ball interaction proposed.

I think such footage should exist, because video analysis used in sports is not a new concept, but whether someone has ready access to it and is willing to share it with the general public, not treating it as though it's some sort of trade secret, that I don't know.
Back to Top
ichini View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member
Avatar

Joined: 04/29/2010
Location: China
Status: Offline
Points: 128
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ichini Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/06/2010 at 2:59am
Hi everybody,do any of you know what DVD teaches how to perform a european  forehand loop?I've been using a chinese forehand loop and would like to learn the european forehand loop,i feel that learning both of the loops can be some thing good,like combining both of them together of using them in different situations.so any help will be greatly appreciated.Thanks in advance.
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1 34567 16>
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 12.01
Copyright ©2001-2018 Web Wiz Ltd.

This page was generated in 0.172 seconds.

Become a Fan on Facebook Follow us on Twitter Web Wiz News
About MyTableTennis.NET | Forum Help | Disclaimer

MyTableTennis.NET is the trading name of Alex Table Tennis Ltd.

Copyright ©2003-2020 Alex Table Tennis Ltd. All rights reserved.