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Donic Crest Off

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AndySmith View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote AndySmith Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/04/2015 at 1:20pm
https://www.topspintt.com/products/blades/450/crest-off-blades

Says Made in Germany here. Lot of misinformation about Crest around though. Don't trust anything.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nv42 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/04/2015 at 4:41pm
Hey Andy, incase yuv tried the xiom vega pro, how would yua Crest compare? Pretty sure the vega pro would be faster, but in terms of top end power, spin (dwell I guess) and throw.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AndySmith Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/04/2015 at 4:53pm
Originally posted by nv42 nv42 wrote:

Hey Andy, incase yuv tried the xiom vega pro, how would yua Crest compare? Pretty sure the vega pro would be faster, but in terms of top end power, spin (dwell I guess) and throw.

Coincidentally, I got a Vega Pro at the same time as my first Crest AR+.  I had a very brief go, but I've fallen hard for the Crest.

My VP is 84g, Crest 92g, so that will be making a difference.  But the Crest is noticeably a bit faster and stiffer, and has a sharper feel on blocks and drives which I just love.  VP felt like it had more dwell and I could load the spin up more easily with it.  The main thing I immediately disliked about the VP were the wings, which were annoying me straight away.  Crest was a lot more comfortable for my grip, but YMMV obviously.

Crest threw a bit lower but on brushy shots I could hardly tell the difference.  The Crest feels a tad more solid and powerful on drives and hits, which is a big plus for me with the new ball.

Both good blades, Crest is the big winner for me at the moment.  Honestly, fantastic blade.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LennyG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/04/2015 at 9:45pm
Andy, if you familiar with Stratus Power Wood, can you compare your Crest to it?
Thanks
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AndySmith Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/05/2015 at 3:52am
Originally posted by LennyG LennyG wrote:

Andy, if you familiar with Stratus Power Wood, can you compare your Crest to it?
Thanks

Crest is faster, stiffer for sure.  Also a bit harder, and I don't just mean because of the composite.  The limba they use on the Crest (or perhaps the factory seal is doing this) has a slightly harder, sharper feel to it than most blades with limba/limba outers.  Crest throws a bit lower but not much in it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nv42 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/05/2015 at 5:00am
Awesome! Thanks Andy! Just what I wanted to know :).. And enjoy your Crest haha..
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/05/2015 at 10:44am
The Vega blades, the straight handles are light years ahead of the flare handles - just saying.  That was my biggest mistake - buying my first Vega blades in flare handle.
I like putting heavy topspin on the ball...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AndySmith Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/05/2015 at 11:51am
Originally posted by NextLevel NextLevel wrote:

The Vega blades, the straight handles are light years ahead of the flare handles - just saying.  That was my biggest mistake - buying my first Vega blades in flare handle.

I always default to FL handles, but you may be right.  It's all academic now anyway - VP seems like a top blade (apart from the comfort factor for me), but the Crest is a much better fit for me.  I'm done for a while now.  Just rotating rubbers to find the best fit.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LennyG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/05/2015 at 3:09pm
Thanks Andy.
So I understand that it's faster do everything well blade. Intresting.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nv42 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/05/2015 at 3:45pm
Lol. I actually bought the St handle because FL was outta stock. I tried a friend's vega pro FL and I do like the St more since I like a lil thick handles. And yeah imo, vega pro is the best blade I have ever played with, Atleast for me ( aggressive two winged looper ). This is the only thing that gives me the power of a composite blade combined with the feel n dwell of an all wood. And yeah it also has that safety factor which let's me swing all out knowing that the ball is gonna land in for sure! MX-P works extremely well on the VP for me, though I'm planning on changing the O5pro soon (i got the pre assembled setup from tt11, came a lot cheaper overall) already sold my black O5pro. Gonna use rakza7 which is a lot more powerful.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote slevin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/05/2015 at 3:51pm
Too bad for me: I've tried 3 Vega Pros and never found one I quite liked (as some other blade I owned at that time).


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote slevin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/05/2015 at 3:53pm
Originally posted by AndySmith AndySmith wrote:

I'm done for a while now.

The countdown starts NOW! Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nv42 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/05/2015 at 4:39pm
Your current blade seems a whole lot differnt than vega pro slevin , hard outer plies n GlassFiber ( really curious to how a gf blade plays :P). VP does feel a tad bit flexier than similar bty blades, and my friends FL VP feels really flexier and slower than my St VP. Sorry for derailing the thread lol.. Was really interested in trying the Crest cuz of its awesome build(soulspin <3) and unique comp though I guess I'll hold off for now.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Wolf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/06/2015 at 4:56pm
Hi Andy , 
I see well , that you took the second the same Crest AR ? 
Me also the Crest Off to devour enough of that already, I also have a second backup . This time I chose holding AN and I have to say , that is great . I have a large palm and holding it is perfect . If I bought another , bought I again AN . 
Today test the backup Crest Off with a rubber Xiom Vega Pro Max and Sigma II EURO max . 
Vega Pro max for me quite a disappointment . This great rubber had almost no catapult. Maybe good for someone who likes to have great control ,my cup of tea but it is not . 
A nice surprise is the Sigma II EURO max . Very friendly , central hr, and a beautiful response with a pleasant ,,CLICK,, with every stroke . Blocks and short game is a dream ,I see the great potential of the rubber on the back . On the front end, I like the harder and firmer feeling . 
Someone has the knowledge to compare the overall feeling of the hardness and h Sigma I, Sigma Pro and Sigma EU in chub max ? 
Thank you , 
W.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jackass22 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/07/2015 at 3:55pm
Andy, wolf Could you please compare acuda p2 and adidas p7 on the crest ar+?
What others rubber have you tested on crest?
Can you compare it?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote slevin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/07/2015 at 4:17pm
Originally posted by nv42 nv42 wrote:

Your current blade seems a whole lot differnt than vega pro slevin , hard outer plies n GlassFiber ( really curious to how a gf blade plays :P). VP does feel a tad bit flexier than similar bty blades, and my friends FL VP feels really flexier and slower than my St VP. Sorry for derailing the thread lol.. Was really interested in trying the Crest cuz of its awesome build(soulspin <3) and unique comp though I guess I'll hold off for now.

My comment was more towards the VP.

Soulspin is awesome: I demo'ed the Holz Sieben earlier and I'm currently trying out the Nittaku Basaltec Outer at the moment (having bought one for myself) with MX-P on both sides and it feels amazing. I love their blades.

It enters my Pantheon of Good Blades. Other members include the Barwell Fleet, MJ-SZLC and Holz Sieben.

I briefly tried their Waldner '89 as well but my personal preference is towards blades with composite material close to the outer layer.

the Crest AR+ seems to be the limba-outer version of the Waldner '89 (which had spruce outer).


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AndySmith Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/07/2015 at 4:52pm
Originally posted by jackass22 jackass22 wrote:

Andy, wolf Could you please compare acuda p2 and adidas p7 on the crest ar+?
What others rubber have you tested on crest?
Can you compare it?

I feel that P2 is a much better rubber than P3, which is just too soft and flaccid for me.  P2 has the necessary solidity to work well, but has a quite fierce top end speed.  The topsheet grips well and feels reliable, but it is a fast rubber.  Maybe too fast for me.

P7 remains a brilliant rubber, and pairs up amazingly well with the AR+ IMO.  I'd probably commit to it fully but there are obvious long term issues with using it.  Maybe it is a little bit bouncy, but with the plastic ball that seems to help rather than hinder me.  The AR+ has the guts and power behind it to make P7 shine.  Amazing combo.  Agony that it isn't going to be available in the future.

Other stuff?  I've switched to JP03 on the BH side in recent weeks and that works wonderfully.  I gave M3 a brief run out on the FH side and it felt hollow and lacked power, but this was the first time I'd used it with plastic.  I'd guess that M2 would work, but there are probably better options from more recent ranges.

I've also had a quick go with Big Dipper 38 and Saturn Pro, just for old time's sake.  This was an OK setup, very head heavy though.  BD on the FH felt very all-or-nothing on the AR+.  It produced nasty low-arc high-spin drives (many winners) and a lot of nothing balls (many easy balls for the opponent).  Not sure about this setup yet.  Might not be a good idea.  Good control over the table though - some incredibly tight pushes.

In the cupboard and ready to go are Omega 5 Asia, Aeolus 45, Rakza X, Hurricane 8, Skyline 3-60 and some assorted Adidas rubbers which I shouldn't really bother with if I'm honest.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote slevin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/07/2015 at 4:57pm
Originally posted by slevin slevin wrote:

the Crest AR+ seems to be the limba-outer version of the Waldner '89 (which had spruce outer).

Actually, based on this, the composite stuff layers in the AR+ are closer to the outer layer rather than to the core (as I earlier thought).

But what's with the blade size: 155x146 according to the Donic website?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AndySmith Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/07/2015 at 5:05pm
Originally posted by slevin slevin wrote:

Originally posted by slevin slevin wrote:

the Crest AR+ seems to be the limba-outer version of the Waldner '89 (which had spruce outer).

Actually, based on this, the composite stuff layers in the AR+ are closer to the outer layer rather than to the core (as I earlier thought).

But what's with the blade size: 155x146 according to the Donic website?

Nope nope nope nope.  Most of the info you can find online is wrong, and looks to have been copy/pasted from the Crest Off.  And the headsize is wrong too.  Check my posts earlier in this thread for more info.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote slevin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/07/2015 at 5:08pm
Originally posted by AndySmith AndySmith wrote:


Nope nope nope nope.  Most of the info you can find online is wrong, and looks to have been copy/pasted from the Crest Off.  And the headsize is wrong too.  Check my posts earlier in this thread for more info.

Thanks. Yes, I noticed that according to you, this blade has a WWC'89-like composition 

It is amazing: Donic's own website (whose link I posted) gives wrong information about a Donic blade. Perhaps this shows how much of a small-scale industry this whole TT thing is?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AndySmith Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/07/2015 at 5:27pm
It's a bit embarrassing, and I guess Donic could have lost a few sales because of it.  You'd expect it more with cheaper blades I suppose, but not on higher-end stuff like this.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/09/2015 at 10:54am
not taking their composition into account and by cross referencing the various posts on this thread, I gather the Crest AR+ is similar in its attributes than the Barwell Fleet, with AR+ having a slightly higher speed both good control and feel and solidity but without direct comparison.  Could anyone estimate / state where the  AR+ having enough strong attributes different from the BWF to buy. This is from the perspective of someone who is willing to pay for equipment but not without justification.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bran Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/09/2015 at 11:09am
Faster than the BF? Unlikely, given the BF is already on the higher end of the OFF spectrum.

I have a harder time assessing the AR+ actual speed, given Donic rates it as OFF- at most while Andy says it's OFF and compares it with the I ZLC, which I find firmly in the OFF category. If the Crest OFF is also OFF, then what's left between the two?

I'd like to have more AR+ samples to know whether Andy's is an outlier.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/09/2015 at 12:48pm
Originally posted by Bran Bran wrote:

Faster than the BF? Unlikely, given the BF is already on the higher end of the OFF spectrum.

I have a harder time assessing the AR+ actual speed, given Donic rates it as OFF- at most while Andy says it's OFF and compares it with the I ZLC, which I find firmly in the OFF category. If the Crest OFF is also OFF, then what's left between the two?

I'd like to have more AR+ samples to know whether Andy's is an outlier.

it could be the one Andy has is faster than the norm.  I estimated AR+ is (slightly) faster than BWF because I found the Vega Euro which is slower than the Pro (or at least equal) is,including catapult,  has more power than the BWF.  Also I found the IF ZLC to have more power than the BWF (which incidentally I love).  This is all limited to the sample I tried.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AndySmith Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/09/2015 at 4:09pm
I've never used the Barwell Fleet...

About the speed, and Donic's marketing/ratings.  I've just come from 6 months of using a WSC JO, 88g.  I switched to the Crest AR+, 91g, same rubbers.  The AR+ is noticeably faster - it's obvious.  This is in spite of Donic rating the Crest as AR+/OFF- and the WSC as AR+/OFF-/OFF.  Now, how a blade can occupy 3 speed ratings is left up to you to interpret, because I'm not sure how that works really.

About the distinction between the two Crest blades - I haven't used the Crest Off, but the differences aren't major in terms of construction.  We are perhaps talking about the difference between, say, a Butterfly JM and an IF-ZLC.  There will likely be differences in feel and some noticeable bits around the edges (maybe the Crest Off will be stiffer, but bouncier in low gears but slower in high gears, whatever).  But in no way should anyone expect the Crest AR+ to be an Allround + blade.  If you wanted to call the WSC an AR+ blade (and maybe that's fair these days, I think it's lower OFF- myself) then the Crest AR+ is middle of OFF-.

But yes, it's always sensible to have reservations about people's descriptions of blades, and my two could be oddly fast variations.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote tom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/09/2015 at 5:10pm
I am tempted to get the AR+, will wait for next week in case more revelation comes to light
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Wolf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/11/2015 at 2:51pm
Hi Tom , 
I have tried some time ago Barwell Fleet ,I tried Crest AR and finally ended up with the Crest Off . I would like to say that all three of the blades have a first-class treatment and it is up to you , that you choose for your style of play and what you like the feel . 
The speed of the Crest ARE are on the bottom of the border Off , maybe up to the middle of the Off . 
Crest Off is one step faster ,definitely but with great control and feeling in control doesn't feel as fast as it actually is . Barwell Fleet is similarly fast as the Crest Off ,but has a different feel . Although to me some time ago with Barweel Fleet played quite well , missed I any strength, and lacked the rotation to complete the winning point . In short, for my opponent I was a little uncomfortable and a lot of balls to me out still back . Barwell me meet in the middle distance , at the table I missed the feeling of the bite of the ball . Donic Crest for my game I found exactly what I lacked in Barwell at the lower scenes . Picking the I between the Crest of the AR and the Crest OFF and in the end I prefer the Off although would give me the speed he could and Crest AR . 
Crest AR for me has unfortunately much of the high hr , so I became with the Crest Off . 
Crest AR I would recommend to anyone for any reason as well as me not liking the Boll ZLF . Your game is at the table ,uses very sure about the block and waiting for every possible counter attack to punish the opponent . 
Crest Off can reach out to those who is looking for a similar feel as has the Boll ZLC , Jun Mizutani ,the only not so great catapult ,but I still spin the blades of every opportunity with a large degree of abandonment, and not punish mistakes as the first two of them . Appropriate at the table and middle distance . 
With the Barwell Fleet can be satisfied those who seek mainly security and control in the middle distance and relied repeatedly on the accuracy of its location. 
Please, however, remember that it all depends on how it pair with the appropriate rubber for your style of play . Depending on the different types of rubber then depend the overall speed of the combination . 
On my backup the Crest Off of what I have tried is the Acuda S3 max, overall, slower than, for example, Crest AR + MXP 2.0 mm or Omega IN the EU to 2.0 mm . 
Perhaps I help a little Smile
Wolf .
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/11/2015 at 8:39pm
Wolf,how would the AR+ compare in terms of power vs BWF at the low end and the high end? Please do the same comparison for the Off vs the BWF as well. Thanks.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AndySmith Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/27/2015 at 11:45am
Originally posted by slevin slevin wrote:

Originally posted by AndySmith AndySmith wrote:

I'm done for a while now.

The countdown starts NOW! Smile

Still ticking, still an amazing blade.  I look at other things and just feel that they would never be as complete a package.  Life is good, but very boring too.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote the_theologian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/27/2015 at 12:10pm
Originally posted by AndySmith AndySmith wrote:

Originally posted by slevin slevin wrote:

Originally posted by AndySmith AndySmith wrote:

I'm done for a while now.

The countdown starts NOW! Smile

Still ticking, still an amazing blade.  I look at other things and just feel that they would never be as complete a package.  Life is good, but very boring too.

Once you try the Hayabusa Zi the clock will reset. LOL
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