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Ittf ball release |
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igorponger
Premier Member Joined: 07/29/2006 Location: Everywhere Status: Offline Points: 3252 |
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Still feeling unhappy over Palio ball play?
Just make one tiny puncture into the ball's shell. You will be happily surprised at how better the ball plays with the pin hole. |
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seguso
Gold Member Joined: 03/24/2010 Location: Italy Status: Offline Points: 1619 |
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interesting... then maybe it's the lack of seam that makes it spin different? once you introduce an irregularity, it starts spinning more?
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pg5x - mxd fh & bh - 2015 video
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cole_ely
Premier Member Joined: 03/16/2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 6899 |
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Release of internal pressure?
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Wavestone St with Illumina 1.9r, defender1.7b
Please let me know if I can be of assistance. |
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gatorling
Super Member Joined: 06/09/2010 Location: Florida, USA Status: Offline Points: 381 |
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I'm not exactly a mechanical/aerospace engineer..or have much experience in fluid dynamics so maybe someone else can chime in here.
When a ball spins it creates a differential in air flow speed with relationship to the spin. For underspin the air is moving fast on the top of the ball is comparison to the air under the ball. This creates a low pressure zone on top of the ball and a higher pressure zone underneath the ball. What you get is "lift" effect. Do the opposite and you get a "drag down" effect. When you have a seam the seam will cause the ball to catch more of the air and you end up with a more pronounced lift or drag down effect. Of course a table tennis ball is far from perfect, if the ball is rotating the the seams are perpendicular to the rotation then you will get more spin. If the seam is parallel then you will get slightly less spin. The ideal gemoetry for consistency is a perfectly round ball with no seams but a good compromise is something like a golf ball..where you have intentional dimples. Of course this would result in strange bounces..so maybe settling for something closer to a baseball is OK. So yes, seam affects the EFFECTS of spin on the ball but should not affect how much spin is imparted onto the ball. A seamed ball obviously is much easier to produce as you can control the wall thickness of the ball relatively easily using molds. A seamless ball however would be difficult to create. Maybe they just take a small solid ball and inflate it while it is under heat. It would be very difficult to create a uniform wall thickness while maintaining tight weight tolerances and roundness. A seamless ball will obviously result in a much more expensive ball until they solve production issues. Like the report says, the yields are abysmal. The end result? Expensive table tennis balls and possible shortages for the first several months of production (maybe even the first year of production). Which is why ITTF is planning for a phased introduction. To be honest a executive decision needs to be made and the balls must not be released until yields and tolerances meets or exceeds today's table tennis ball yields and tolerances. To do anything else would result in a complete mess and endless frustration for players. I for one, would hate to see tournament results determined by which ball is being used.
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Forehand: Hurricane 3 Provincial #20 sponge
Backhand: Rakza 7 Max Blade: Xiom Aria |
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BMonkey
Gold Member Joined: 11/28/2008 Status: Offline Points: 1015 |
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An interesting video I came across on a website. If it's true, there's more merit to the ITTF's claim about the celluloid dust being dangerous, because if they combust this fast in solid form, it'd be scary in dust form.
Edited by BMonkey - 07/02/2013 at 1:15pm |
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j-bo
Super Member Joined: 03/23/2012 Location: Louisiana Status: Offline Points: 454 |
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Not this again..
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roundrobin
Premier Member Joined: 10/02/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 4708 |
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Palio should release a similar video with crushed seamless balls to show how "safe" they are when ignited! Betcha the smoke will be pitch black and will kill ya in 30 seconds if inhaled! |
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Current USATT Rating: 2181
Argentina National Team Member, 1985-1986. Current Club: Los Angeles Table Tennis Association. My Setup: Yinhe Q1 / T64 2.1 black / Saviga V 0.5mm red |
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bluebucket
Platinum Member Joined: 02/20/2011 Location: 16 Status: Offline Points: 2882 |
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Everyone knows celluloid is highly flammable... So are lots of other totally legal and safe things. Let's ban Eucalyptus leaves maybe?
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BMonkey
Gold Member Joined: 11/28/2008 Status: Offline Points: 1015 |
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Well, I don't think that flammable balls should be banned. But I feel like some people don't really believe they're flammable. So a video of them actually combusting is the first I've seen.
The safety nannies of the world want everything that's even slightly dangerous banned forever.
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Mastermind
Silver Member Joined: 09/16/2009 Status: Offline Points: 948 |
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Celluloid balls are flammable and absolutely safe under usual conditions.
The same goes for newspapers, for example. Never heard anyone claim newspapers are gangerous, because they are flammable. |
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Mastermind
Silver Member Joined: 09/16/2009 Status: Offline Points: 948 |
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Flammable plastic:
Edited by Mastermind - 07/02/2013 at 6:35pm |
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Mastermind
Silver Member Joined: 09/16/2009 Status: Offline Points: 948 |
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Flammable Common Household Products:
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Mastermind
Silver Member Joined: 09/16/2009 Status: Offline Points: 948 |
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Oranges are flammable!!!
More about orange flammability: http://www.newton.dep.anl.gov/askasci/chem00/chem00857.htm |
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chop4ever
Silver Member Joined: 08/10/2012 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 812 |
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I actually can make a firework rocket by only one ball and a piece of allu-wrap
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There is no real "pro", "prov" or "NT" H3 in the market.
Falco is not a booster |
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JacekGM
Platinum Member Joined: 02/17/2013 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 2356 |
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... and as we exchange nice ideas, others are already seriously evaluating the seamless ball:
The ball is said to hit the table with the sound of a broken celluloid ball, and have a flatter, fast trajectory, with underspin dying out in the flight faster. It supposedly requires more forward-oriented strokes, such that the style of Timo Ball-like topspin attack may become extinguished, it is feared. Fast rallies close to the table, Chinese style, may benefit. Oh boy... I hope we will like it...
Edited by JacekGM - 07/02/2013 at 11:02pm |
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(1) Juic SBA (Fl, 85 g) with Bluefire JP3 (red max) on FH and 0.6 mm DR N Desperado on BH; (2) Yinhe T7 (Fl, 87 g) with Bluefire M3 (red 2.0) on FH and 0.6 mm 755 on BH.
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JacekGM
Platinum Member Joined: 02/17/2013 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 2356 |
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would making a small hole be legal? probably not...
Edited by JacekGM - 07/04/2013 at 8:43pm |
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(1) Juic SBA (Fl, 85 g) with Bluefire JP3 (red max) on FH and 0.6 mm DR N Desperado on BH; (2) Yinhe T7 (Fl, 87 g) with Bluefire M3 (red 2.0) on FH and 0.6 mm 755 on BH.
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amateur
Premier Member Joined: 02/29/2008 Status: Offline Points: 4801 |
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not as long as you use an ITTF-approved ball piercer (to be sold by Butterfly for $25) |
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schen
Gold Member Joined: 03/26/2013 Location: San Diego, CA Status: Offline Points: 1244 |
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A new article about the plastic ball was just published on tabletennista.
On another note, one thing they didn't mention is that the new plastic ball STINGS when you are accidentally hit by it. Taking a loop or a smash to the finger or any other part of skin with the new ball is no fun :(
Edited by schen - 07/04/2013 at 5:42pm |
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ZingyDNA
Platinum Member Joined: 09/19/2008 Status: Offline Points: 2373 |
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That's William Henzell, not Andrew Baggaley testing the new ball |
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dici
Super Member Joined: 06/02/2011 Status: Offline Points: 115 |
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As the other said, he is William, not Andrew. And the video is so old, it was last year before the olympic, i think. The author should had been more carefully on writing an article. |
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wturber
Premier Member Joined: 10/28/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3899 |
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Now this from Larry Thoman ... Got an email from FIT updating me on the patent issue surrounding the poly ball. FIT hired an attorney to evaluate the poly ball patents worldwide and provide an opinion on whether FIT members would be subject to patent infringement lawsuits if they chose to produce non-celluloid balls. It was the judgement of that attorney that indeed companies who produce, sell, or distribute non-celluloid balls in the countries protected by those patents--Europe, US, China, Japan, and possibly Korea if it approves the patent application--could be subject to "enormous legal disputes and litigation". Therefore, the attorney recommended that FIT members restrain from the sale of non-celluloid TT balls. FIT will have meetings at the European Championships and World Cup to discuss the legal findings and what actions to take. But unless something happens pretty quickly to resolve this matter of patent infringement, my guess is that the ITTF will have no choice but to delay implementation beyond 7/1/14 as no manufacturer is going to take a chance on producing the new balls if they are likely to be subjected to patent infringement lawsuits as soon as they do. The lawyer also stated there was an easy way to circumvent the patents if it was possible--simply include a small amount (he suggested 5%) of celluloid in the plastic formulation for the new balls. Whether that is possible or not, I haven't heard, and the lawyer's report does not address that possibility. The report also said that a German Company--Weener Plastik GmbH--has challenged the European patent on grounds of insufficient disclosure, inadmissible extension beyond the content of the application as filed, lack of novelty, and lack of an inventive step. Such legal actions typically take several years to resolve, but in the lawyer's opinion, he believes that Weener will ultimately prevail. Lastly, the lawyer contacted ITTF about his findings and to get a reaction to the problems noted therein. And--surprise, surprise--the ITTF has not responded. Larry So, I guess we can expect Sharara to step in and resolve this as he promised. BTW, if the rumors are true that they've now stopped producing celluloid balls due to the impending move to poly, then we could have a problem if FIT members won't make/ship/sell poly balls. With both sources potentially drying up we could end up with a ball shortage. That would be a huge irony since the claimed main goal of promoting the new poly ball was to avoid a shortage. |
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Jay Turberville
www.jayandwanda.com Hardbat: Nittaku Resist w/ Dr. Evil or Friendship 802-40 OX |
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jt99sf
Premier Member Joined: 04/29/2005 Location: San Francisco Status: Offline Points: 4952 |
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http://www.portlandmercury.com/BlogtownPDX/archives/2013/06/13/hollywood-theatre-goes-digital-has-plans-for-70mm
Celluloid is not dead since the film industry is going to use the 70mm format.
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Photino/Super Viscaria : H3 (FH)/Dr N pips(BH)
林德成 HardBat:Hock 3-Ply /Dr Evil |
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wturber
Premier Member Joined: 10/28/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3899 |
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Celluloid hasn't been used in film for well over 50 years now. Film guys use the term "celluloid" rather loosely - perhaps out of nostalgia. But the industry switched to cellulose acetate or other materials quite some time ago. I think before I was born. Sharara made the same mistake when he quite mistakenly stated that the bad things about celluloid (like those pesky but hard to find celluloid fibers) are some of the reasons why the film industry is moving to digital - thus demonstrating how poorly he has researched this subject. Edited by wturber - 09/12/2013 at 3:39pm |
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Jay Turberville
www.jayandwanda.com Hardbat: Nittaku Resist w/ Dr. Evil or Friendship 802-40 OX |
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