Alex Table Tennis - MyTableTennis.NET Homepage
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Nittaku Violin vs Nittaku Acoustic
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

Nittaku Violin vs Nittaku Acoustic

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  123>
Author
dyfferent View Drop Down
Member
Member


Joined: 11/09/2019
Location: Deutschland
Status: Offline
Points: 38
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dyfferent Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Nittaku Violin vs Nittaku Acoustic
    Posted: 11/17/2019 at 5:33am
I am looking for a cure of my EJ virus. Please help me out Big smileBig smile
I am a believer of the Chinese Philosophy: Blade provides feeling and the rubbers provide the speed. My current setup is: Primorac FL 87g with DHS Hurricane 3 Provincial OS 41° 2.15mm on forehand and an old sheet of Butterfly Tenergy 05 2.0 red on backhand. I plan to try out DHS Hurricane 3 Provincial BS 40° 2.15mm on my forehand and DHS Skyline 3-60 mid-hard (~37°) on my backhand. I have Chinese-like strokes on both my forehand and backhand and my backhand is better from a couple of steps away from the table. I usually win with spin, but can generate speed through my physique. I prefer control over speed or power, because I can provide those myself.
Now the questions of questions: Should I go for the Acoustic or the Violin? 
My research came up with the following differences (only the new versions):
                                  Acoustic                                                              Violin 
Plies:    Limba-Limba-Tung-Limba-Limba     WhiteAsh-WhiteAsh-Kiri-WhiteAsh-WhiteAsh
Something I could not find is the thickness of each ply. If anyone could supply that , that would be awesome. 
Size:    158x150       5.7mm thick                    156x149         5.3mm thick
If you approximate the Surface area of a blade as an ellipsis, you get: 
             186.159cm^2                                        182.558cm^2
Leaving a discrepancy of ~3.6cm^2, which should be interesting for the choice of rubber. This means Acoustic becomes more hear heavy and heavier overall by a gram or two.

As I said, this blades is supposed to cure my emerging EJ virus once and for all. I like the look of the violin handle better than the acoustic. I like the idea of it being somewhat different to my Primorac. But would I instead just get the more similar one and go for the Acoustic ? 
Can you guys help me out ?

Back to Top
Simon_plays View Drop Down
Silver Member
Silver Member


Joined: 05/02/2015
Location: Vietnam
Status: Offline
Points: 701
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Simon_plays Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/17/2019 at 8:08am
I genuinely think there is no way to tell which of these blades will suit anyone better unless they've tried them for a longer period. 

Also, if you're going to change both rubbers and your blade at the same time it will be very difficult to tell why your new set up will be different to your old one. 

I would say keep your current blade and just get some new rubbers.  These blades are far more expensive than a Primorac but that doesn't mean they'll play much better. 
Back to Top
jpenmaster View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member


Joined: 12/24/2008
Location: Chicago
Status: Offline
Points: 1826
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jpenmaster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/17/2019 at 10:52am
Your Primorac is right in between Acoustic and Violin in terms of speed. So the question to ask yourself is do you want a little more control or a little more speed.  Violin is more of an ALL + blade to me.  For Butterfly and Nittaku 5 plys in terms of speed i rate them as Violin<Primorac<Acoustic <Korbel<Tenor<Mazunov. 
Kenta ALC T05H/T05
Back to Top
piligrim View Drop Down
Premier Member
Premier Member
Avatar

Joined: 06/21/2011
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 4259
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote piligrim Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/17/2019 at 11:13am
They both beautiful blades and must have in collection
Back to Top
dyfferent View Drop Down
Member
Member


Joined: 11/09/2019
Location: Deutschland
Status: Offline
Points: 38
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dyfferent Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/17/2019 at 11:27am
I think all your points are valid. 

Originally posted by Simon_plays Simon_plays wrote:

I genuinely think there is no way to tell which of these blades will suit anyone better unless they've tried them for a longer period. 
I need to try both blades for some time and with the same rubbers to know for sure.

Originally posted by jpenmaster jpenmaster wrote:

Your Primorac is right in between Acoustic and Violin in terms of speed. So the question to ask yourself is do you want a little more control or a little more speed.  Violin is more of an ALL + blade to me.  For Butterfly and Nittaku 5 plys in terms of speed i rate them as Violin<Primorac<Acoustic <Korbel<Tenor<Mazunov. 
I think I want more control, so I know what blade to go for.

Originally posted by piligrim piligrim wrote:

They both beautiful blades and must have in collection
I really am someone that is very visual. If my rubber isn't cut properly it annoys me. That is also why I don't want to play with my Primorac anymore. It looks worn and has many dents on the blades' surface. 
To illustrate how visual I am: I just saw a DHS Hurricane King with Hurricane 3 blue sponge in black on its forehand, and it looked so flawless. The gray face of the blade, the black handle and the blue sponged black rubber were simply stunning. I guess I need to be pleased with the look of the blade. So I guess it now is Violin vs Hurricane King ConfusedLOL

Edit: it was a globe blue sponged rubber... http://mytabletennis.net/forum/members-of-dhs-hurricane-king_topic19957_page1.html


Edited by dyfferent - 11/17/2019 at 11:35am
Back to Top
piligrim View Drop Down
Premier Member
Premier Member
Avatar

Joined: 06/21/2011
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 4259
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote piligrim Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/17/2019 at 11:51am
Originally posted by dyfferent dyfferent wrote:


Originally posted by piligrim piligrim wrote:

They both beautiful blades and must have in collection
I really am someone that is very visual. If my rubber isn't cut properly it annoys me. That is also why I don't want to play with my Primorac anymore. It looks worn and has many dents on the blades' surface. 
To illustrate how visual I am: I just saw a DHS Hurricane King with Hurricane 3 blue sponge in black on its forehand, and it looked so flawless. The gray face of the blade, the black handle and the blue sponged black rubber were simply stunning. I guess I need to be pleased with the look of the blade. So I guess it now is Violin vs Hurricane King ConfusedLOL

Edit: it was a globe blue sponged rubber... http://mytabletennis.net/forum/members-of-dhs-hurricane-king_topic19957_page1.html





just get Stiga Offensive Classic. it same Hurricane King for third price

Back to Top
stiltt View Drop Down
Premier Member
Premier Member
Avatar

Joined: 07/15/2007
Location: Pongville, WA
Status: Offline
Points: 16519
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote stiltt Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/17/2019 at 11:55am
To me they are both jewels for what they are good at. I prefer the Violin because it's more suited for the allround player with its rallying and divine blocking capabilities; I see the Acoustic as the best all wood 5-ply for the looping oriented player.
No blade ever gave me a better sense of "I can't miss" than the Violin. That feeling that nobody can kick me out of the point raises the Violin to the pantheon of tt blades but it's personal of course, some people say the same about the Primorac all wood 5-ply that I never liked; blades like the Avalox P500, the Butterfly Korbel, the Tibhar Samsonov Alpha, the Nexy Spear, the Xiom Aria are great all wood 5-ply but somehow they all fall short of something and I always come back to the Violin.


Edited by stiltt - 11/17/2019 at 11:56am
Back to Top
dyfferent View Drop Down
Member
Member


Joined: 11/09/2019
Location: Deutschland
Status: Offline
Points: 38
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dyfferent Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/17/2019 at 11:55am
Originally posted by piligrim piligrim wrote:

Originally posted by dyfferent dyfferent wrote:


Originally posted by piligrim piligrim wrote:

They both beautiful blades and must have in collection
I really am someone that is very visual. If my rubber isn't cut properly it annoys me. That is also why I don't want to play with my Primorac anymore. It looks worn and has many dents on the blades' surface. 
To illustrate how visual I am: I just saw a DHS Hurricane King with Hurricane 3 blue sponge in black on its forehand, and it looked so flawless. The gray face of the blade, the black handle and the blue sponged black rubber were simply stunning. I guess I need to be pleased with the look of the blade. So I guess it now is Violin vs Hurricane King ConfusedLOL

Edit: it was a globe blue sponged rubber... http://mytabletennis.net/forum/members-of-dhs-hurricane-king_topic19957_page1.html





just get Stiga Offensive Classic. it same Hurricane King for third price


I think that only goes for the old version; the new version uses limba as its outermost ply. But there are avalox p500 and the xiom fuga have the same ply configuration.
Back to Top
dyfferent View Drop Down
Member
Member


Joined: 11/09/2019
Location: Deutschland
Status: Offline
Points: 38
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dyfferent Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/17/2019 at 11:58am
Originally posted by stiltt stiltt wrote:

To me they are both jewels for what they are good at. I prefer the Violin because it's more suited for the allround player with its rallying and divine blocking capabilities; I see the Acoustic as the best all wood 5-ply for the looping oriented player.
No blade ever gave me a better sense of "I can't miss" than the Violin. That feeling that nobody can kick me out of the point raises the Violin to the pantheon of tt blades but it's personal of course, some people say the same about the Primorac all wood 5-ply that I never liked; blades like the Avalox P500, the Butterfly Korbel, the Tibhar Samsonov Alpha, the Nexy Spear, the Xiom Aria are great all wood 5-ply but somehow they all fall short of something and I always come back to the Violin.

Thing is I would consider myself as a loop oriented player. I spin basically everything, but I value control more than speed. Thing I need to find out is whether I value control over spin, or looping...
Also heard the Acoustic is head heavy, which I don't like.


Edited by dyfferent - 11/17/2019 at 11:58am
Back to Top
Ray View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member
Avatar

Joined: 02/28/2012
Location: Online
Status: Offline
Points: 1708
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ray Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/17/2019 at 11:59am
Any particular reason not to take Latika into consideration? Nittaku quality blade made in Japan for about one third of the price of Acoustic/Violin.
Life is too short for defensive play.

spinnier.com
fb.me/spinnier
Back to Top
dyfferent View Drop Down
Member
Member


Joined: 11/09/2019
Location: Deutschland
Status: Offline
Points: 38
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dyfferent Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/17/2019 at 12:06pm
Originally posted by Ray Ray wrote:

Any particular reason not to take Latika into consideration? Nittaku quality blade made in Japan for about one third of the price of Acoustic/Violin.
Not really, but I didn't like the Infinity VPS, which has the same ply configuration. I think I want to try out something with a harder outer ply, as I only ever played with limba outer plies. I just heard so many great things about the acoustic, which is why I would consider giving it a try, If I were to be convinced Big smile


Edited by dyfferent - 11/17/2019 at 12:07pm
Back to Top
stiltt View Drop Down
Premier Member
Premier Member
Avatar

Joined: 07/15/2007
Location: Pongville, WA
Status: Offline
Points: 16519
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote stiltt Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/17/2019 at 12:07pm
One day a friend at the club when I was 1200 and looking up to 1600 bought a Violin and he was so excited. He had been 1600 all his life, was in his late 50s 15 years ago, bought a Violin and let me try it saying "It's like magic, it's slow when you want control and fast when you need speed!". Saying that, he summarized its qualities the best. Truth is he was like a kid, he had finally found his blade. 
Nobody will ever be taken seriously saying the Violin is not good at looping, it's a 5-ply all wood after all. I think where the Acoustic would surpass the Violin in looping would be a level far above than ours.
What I have finally settled on thinking of the Violin is that it's better than any other blade at being a true extension of our arm, it gives us what we put in and does not do things on its own. 



Edited by stiltt - 11/17/2019 at 12:08pm
Back to Top
Dream1700 View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: 12/02/2017
Location: USA
Status: Offline
Points: 353
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dream1700 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/17/2019 at 8:27pm
Nittaku blades have thin handles AFAIK. I don't know if the handle shape matters to OP.
Back to Top
dyfferent View Drop Down
Member
Member


Joined: 11/09/2019
Location: Deutschland
Status: Offline
Points: 38
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dyfferent Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/18/2019 at 4:34am
Originally posted by Dream1700 Dream1700 wrote:

Nittaku blades have thin handles AFAIK. I don't know if the handle shape matters to OP.
It does, but the FL LG-type handle seems fine Smile
Back to Top
fmarek View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member
Avatar

Joined: 09/08/2018
Location: Sydney
Status: Offline
Points: 369
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fmarek Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/18/2019 at 6:12am
Does it matter that much? I hardly imagine a situation where you would say, "oh, I lost this because I played with Violin, I should have got myself Acoustic :)"

Get any you like the most, then after 6 month get another one, what's the deal?

EJ orbits are stable, you go: 
All wood then move on to ALC or other carbons, then back to all wood. Alternative entry is through carbon to all wood and back :)

Honestly, I doubt that you can get noticeably more spin than with Primorac. If Primorac is not spinny or not controllable enough for you, your problem is either lack of technique or crazy hard FH rubber (you use H41), but most likely - both factors.

I am not fan of boosters, but H41 is meant to be boosted in order to soften it. For normal mortals, like us, hardness 39 DHS scale is a top limit, H38 is spot on. Whatever crazy spinny loop with kick effect you can do now with H41 you will still be able to do with H38 too, but with much higher success rate.

If you have strong wrist then 3-60 in H37 is very good choice, BH or even FH it will play well. Even though H37 label might sound softish after H41, it is a rather firm sponge under not too much elastic topsheet, hence requires powerful shots.

Some time ago I sold AVX J-TECH blade, now I miss it so much. Would exchange Primorac for J-TECH any day. Consider your blade experience incomplete until you try kiso hinoki as top ply. Well, happy e-junking :)

Stiga Celero, FH: 729 08-ES H47, BH: Yinhe Jupiter 2, H38
Yinhe Kiso 5ply, FH: 729 08-ES H47, BH: Hurricane 3 Commercial H39
Back to Top
dyfferent View Drop Down
Member
Member


Joined: 11/09/2019
Location: Deutschland
Status: Offline
Points: 38
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dyfferent Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/18/2019 at 6:39am
Originally posted by fmarek fmarek wrote:

Does it matter that much? I hardly imagine a situation where you would say, "oh, I lost this because I played with Violin, I should have got myself Acoustic :)"

Get any you like the most, then after 6 month get another one, what's the deal?

EJ orbits are stable, you go: 
All wood then move on to ALC or other carbons, then back to all wood. Alternative entry is through carbon to all wood and back :)

Honestly, I doubt that you can get noticeably more spin than with Primorac. If Primorac is not spinny or not controllable enough for you, your problem is either lack of technique or crazy hard FH rubber (you use H41), but most likely - both factors.

I am not fan of boosters, but H41 is meant to be boosted in order to soften it. For normal mortals, like us, hardness 39 DHS scale is a top limit, H38 is spot on. Whatever crazy spinny loop with kick effect you can do now with H41 you will still be able to do with H38 too, but with much higher success rate.

If you have strong wrist then 3-60 in H37 is very good choice, BH or even FH it will play well. Even though H37 label might sound softish after H41, it is a rather firm sponge under not too much elastic topsheet, hence requires powerful shots.

Some time ago I sold AVX J-TECH blade, now I miss it so much. Would exchange Primorac for J-TECH any day. Consider your blade experience incomplete until you try kiso hinoki as top ply. Well, happy e-junking :)


Thanks for the comprehensive answer. I really think I am going for a Violin FL LG. It won't ever make a big difference, even compared to my Primorac. But it's a psychological thing. I just like the look of the Violin and its superb reputation as a controllable blade that is "an extension of your hand". I boosted the 41° Hurricane with 3 layers of falco, so it's not nearly as hard as it used to be and I can handle it pretty well. It like hard rubbers, more linear, I like that. I am only going to use the booster go break in the next Hurricane and I do have a strong and fast wrist, which is why I think the Skyline 3-60 will fit so well. 
I sincerely hope that I am going to stick with the Vioin for some years, if not forever. It seems like a blade that ended quite some EJ careers Smile
Now I just need to decide on a weight of 87,88,89,90,91,92 LOLLOL
Back to Top
fmarek View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member
Avatar

Joined: 09/08/2018
Location: Sydney
Status: Offline
Points: 369
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fmarek Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/18/2019 at 6:41am
Originally posted by dyfferent dyfferent wrote:

I sincerely hope that I am going to stick with the Violin for some years

Until you try ALC :)
 


Stiga Celero, FH: 729 08-ES H47, BH: Yinhe Jupiter 2, H38
Yinhe Kiso 5ply, FH: 729 08-ES H47, BH: Hurricane 3 Commercial H39
Back to Top
dyfferent View Drop Down
Member
Member


Joined: 11/09/2019
Location: Deutschland
Status: Offline
Points: 38
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dyfferent Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/18/2019 at 6:45am
Originally posted by stiltt stiltt wrote:

One day a friend at the club when I was 1200 and looking up to 1600 bought a Violin and he was so excited. He had been 1600 all his life, was in his late 50s 15 years ago, bought a Violin and let me try it saying "It's like magic, it's slow when you want control and fast when you need speed!". Saying that, he summarized its qualities the best. Truth is he was like a kid, he had finally found his blade. 
Nobody will ever be taken seriously saying the Violin is not good at looping, it's a 5-ply all wood after all. I think where the Acoustic would surpass the Violin in looping would be a level far above than ours.
What I have finally settled on thinking of the Violin is that it's better than any other blade at being a true extension of our arm, it gives us what we put in and does not do things on its own. 


This pretty much embodies the kind of reviews that convinced me Smile
Back to Top
dyfferent View Drop Down
Member
Member


Joined: 11/09/2019
Location: Deutschland
Status: Offline
Points: 38
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dyfferent Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/18/2019 at 6:46am
Originally posted by fmarek fmarek wrote:

Originally posted by dyfferent dyfferent wrote:

I sincerely hope that I am going to stick with the Violin for some years

Until you try ALC :)


I have and I don't particularly like the weird vibrations those things give me. I really think the Nittaku Violin FL LG will cure me LOL
Back to Top
fmarek View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member
Avatar

Joined: 09/08/2018
Location: Sydney
Status: Offline
Points: 369
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fmarek Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/18/2019 at 6:50am
Originally posted by dyfferent dyfferent wrote:

Now I just need to decide on a weight of 87,88,89,90,91,92 LOLLOL

If my math is correct, then 3-60 weights around 50g (not more) when cut to 157x150

Since you are boosting and let me guess, using 2x glue layer, then ... 88g ? I wonder how 90+ weights got into your list??


Edited by fmarek - 11/18/2019 at 6:55am
Stiga Celero, FH: 729 08-ES H47, BH: Yinhe Jupiter 2, H38
Yinhe Kiso 5ply, FH: 729 08-ES H47, BH: Hurricane 3 Commercial H39
Back to Top
fmarek View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member
Avatar

Joined: 09/08/2018
Location: Sydney
Status: Offline
Points: 369
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fmarek Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/18/2019 at 6:51am
Originally posted by dyfferent dyfferent wrote:

Originally posted by fmarek fmarek wrote:

Originally posted by dyfferent dyfferent wrote:

I sincerely hope that I am going to stick with the Violin for some years

Until you try ALC :)


I have and I don't particularly like the weird vibrations those things give me. I really think the Nittaku Violin FL LG will cure me LOL

Just for the record, what ALC did you try? My ALC is smooth as butter comparing to Primorac. 
Stiga Celero, FH: 729 08-ES H47, BH: Yinhe Jupiter 2, H38
Yinhe Kiso 5ply, FH: 729 08-ES H47, BH: Hurricane 3 Commercial H39
Back to Top
dyfferent View Drop Down
Member
Member


Joined: 11/09/2019
Location: Deutschland
Status: Offline
Points: 38
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dyfferent Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/18/2019 at 6:58am
Originally posted by fmarek fmarek wrote:

Originally posted by dyfferent dyfferent wrote:

Now I just need to decide on a weight of 87,88,89,90,91,92 LOLLOL

If my math is correct, then 3-60 weights around 50g (not more) when cut to 157x150 this is Primorac's head size. Violin is 156x149 afaik, but that'll only be a couple of grams difference.

Since you are boosting and let me guess, using 2x glue layer how did you know LOLLOLLOLLOL
 then ... 88g ? I wonder how 90+ wights got into your list?? I asked tt11 for their weights and since Primorac is faster I thought I get a heavier violin to compensate. Also heavier is also denser wood. so better quality?
Back to Top
dyfferent View Drop Down
Member
Member


Joined: 11/09/2019
Location: Deutschland
Status: Offline
Points: 38
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dyfferent Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/18/2019 at 7:00am
Originally posted by fmarek fmarek wrote:


Just for the record, what ALC did you try? My ALC is smooth as butter comparing to Primorac. 

I tried my coaches Timo Boll Spirit with boosted Tenergy 05 and a mates andro Treiber something as well as another Butterfly ALC carbon. I also tried an inner carbon alc by butterfly at their store.

the feeling I was talking about is probably only the lack of lower frequency vibrations from the wood and the higher frequency vibrations of the carbon. It feels funny to me, as I never played with carbon for a longer period. I think it is because the natural vibrations of the wood become muffled because the carbon stiffens the blade and overshadows them.


Edited by dyfferent - 11/18/2019 at 7:03am
Back to Top
dyfferent View Drop Down
Member
Member


Joined: 11/09/2019
Location: Deutschland
Status: Offline
Points: 38
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dyfferent Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/18/2019 at 7:15am
My Calculation was something like:

blade surface 157x150=194.7sqcm (somewhere in a forum talking about old butterfly blades surface) 

blade surface 157x150 (approximated as ellipsis)=184.9sqcm
blade surface 156x149 (approximated as ellipsis)=182.5sqcm
difference ellipsis=2.4sqcm
so blade surface 194.7sqcm-2.4sqcm=192.3sqcm

192.3sqcm×0.256g/sqcm(Hurricane 2.2BS)=49.2288
192.3sqcmx0.24g/sqcm(Median of 3-60 soft and regular Skyline3)=46.152
total=95.37675

I don't even know how this is supposed to help me decide Cry
Back to Top
fmarek View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member
Avatar

Joined: 09/08/2018
Location: Sydney
Status: Offline
Points: 369
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fmarek Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/18/2019 at 7:16am
Originally posted by dyfferent dyfferent wrote:

Originally posted by fmarek fmarek wrote:


Just for the record, what ALC did you try? My ALC is smooth as butter comparing to Primorac. 

I tried my coaches Timo Boll Spirit with boosted Tenergy 05 and a mates andro Treiber something as well as another Butterfly ALC carbon. I also tried an inner carbon alc by butterfly at their store.

the feeling I was talking about is probably only the lack of lower frequency vibrations from the wood and the higher frequency vibrations of the carbon. It feels funny to me, as I never played with carbon for a longer period. I think it is because the natural vibrations of the wood become muffled because the carbon stiffens the blade and overshadows them.

Vibrations subject is difficult to reason about, people receive it differently. ALC meant to dumpen them. What you felt could be what other people refer to as "crisp" feeling of outer koto. I thoughts it is weird when tried first time, but love it now. It's like ball on your palm, you know exactly where it's landed. Limba never gave me that feel.
Stiga Celero, FH: 729 08-ES H47, BH: Yinhe Jupiter 2, H38
Yinhe Kiso 5ply, FH: 729 08-ES H47, BH: Hurricane 3 Commercial H39
Back to Top
dyfferent View Drop Down
Member
Member


Joined: 11/09/2019
Location: Deutschland
Status: Offline
Points: 38
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dyfferent Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/18/2019 at 7:20am
Originally posted by fmarek fmarek wrote:

Originally posted by dyfferent dyfferent wrote:

Originally posted by fmarek fmarek wrote:


Just for the record, what ALC did you try? My ALC is smooth as butter comparing to Primorac. 

I tried my coaches Timo Boll Spirit with boosted Tenergy 05 and a mates andro Treiber something as well as another Butterfly ALC carbon. I also tried an inner carbon alc by butterfly at their store.

the feeling I was talking about is probably only the lack of lower frequency vibrations from the wood and the higher frequency vibrations of the carbon. It feels funny to me, as I never played with carbon for a longer period. I think it is because the natural vibrations of the wood become muffled because the carbon stiffens the blade and overshadows them.

Vibrations subject is difficult to reason about, people receive it differently. ALC meant to dumpen them. What you felt could be what other people refer to as "crisp" feeling of outer koto. I thoughts it is weird when tried first time, but love it now. It's like ball on your palm, you know exactly where it's landed. Limba never gave me that feel.

Which is why I am buying the violin which doesn't have limba outers LOL
but I'm going to stick to all wood until I really need more speed, which I doubt will ever happen.  I know oberliga players that play with stiga allround or offensive classic and have a forehand like Shocked ... a truck, a train or something similarly big, heavy or fast 


Edited by dyfferent - 11/18/2019 at 7:23am
Back to Top
fmarek View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member
Avatar

Joined: 09/08/2018
Location: Sydney
Status: Offline
Points: 369
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fmarek Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/18/2019 at 7:22am
Originally posted by dyfferent dyfferent wrote:

My Calculation was something like:

blade surface 157x150=194.7sqcm (somewhere in a forum talking about old butterfly blades surface) 

blade surface 157x150 (approximated as ellipsis)=184.9sqcm
blade surface 156x149 (approximated as ellipsis)=182.5sqcm
difference ellipsis=2.4sqcm
so blade surface 194.7sqcm-2.4sqcm=192.3sqcm

192.3sqcm×0.256g/sqcm(Hurricane 2.2BS)=49.2288
192.3sqcmx0.24g/sqcm(Median of 3-60 soft and regular Skyline3)=46.152
total=95.37675

I don't even know how this is supposed to help me decide Cry

If this is correct then 87g
Do you really want to play 190g racket!?

P.S. Btw none of my rubbers taken from Viscaria (157x150) cover full surface of Primorac. Primorac head is bigger, right?


Stiga Celero, FH: 729 08-ES H47, BH: Yinhe Jupiter 2, H38
Yinhe Kiso 5ply, FH: 729 08-ES H47, BH: Hurricane 3 Commercial H39
Back to Top
dyfferent View Drop Down
Member
Member


Joined: 11/09/2019
Location: Deutschland
Status: Offline
Points: 38
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dyfferent Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/18/2019 at 7:28am
Originally posted by fmarek fmarek wrote:


If this is correct then 87g
Do you really want to play 190g racket!?

P.S. Btw none of my rubbers taken from Viscaria (157x150) cover full surface of Primorac. Primorac head is bigger, right?


 
How much does glue and edge tape weigh? I think I would be fine with just under 190... ~189 or something like that. I am going to weigh my Primorac later, when I get home and see how much it is. I think I could handle a heavier blade, because I am about 6'0 and quite athletic. I also need to weigh my HL3 which I found to heavy, but that had a bigger head size of 158x150. So it wasn't all about the blade but also the rubbers' size.

I think old Primorac used to be 158x150, but don't quite me in that. I know Korbel is bigger than. 157x150


Edited by dyfferent - 11/18/2019 at 7:30am
Back to Top
fmarek View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member
Avatar

Joined: 09/08/2018
Location: Sydney
Status: Offline
Points: 369
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fmarek Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/18/2019 at 7:37am
Originally posted by dyfferent dyfferent wrote:

...but I'm going to stick to all wood until I really need more speed

I am not trying to change your opinion, but for the completeness of this discussion I have to add one thing. I moved from all wood to ALC with idea to gain a bit of everything and especially, to climb one step in speed while keeping good spin (since blade is 5.8mm). 

Some time after I adjusted, a better player in the club took my racket, looked at handle (ZJK) and said something like "wow". He meant to cheer on the price, thinking it is ZLF. But I told him that it is humble ALC, simpliest of all. His reply shocked me - he said, "ALC, yes very good blade, good for defence". Put racket into my hand and walked away leaving me with my jaw opened. 
"Oh God", I thought. But then after three more months I realised that, he being not English speaker, meant to say "good for control".

ZJK (or Viscaria) ALC is not faster than Primorac. Simply not. Shorter dwell is due to koto layer, but no way it is faster. Enlarged sweet spot - yes. Allows you to comfortably play up to 2 more meters behind the table - yes. Faster? No. Long 5 is faster, but not because of ALC, I think spruce in the 2nd layer springs like crazy.

So, just for the record ALC is good enough once you move past ALL+ level.
Stiga Celero, FH: 729 08-ES H47, BH: Yinhe Jupiter 2, H38
Yinhe Kiso 5ply, FH: 729 08-ES H47, BH: Hurricane 3 Commercial H39
Back to Top
fmarek View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member
Avatar

Joined: 09/08/2018
Location: Sydney
Status: Offline
Points: 369
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fmarek Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/18/2019 at 7:47am
Originally posted by dyfferent dyfferent wrote:

Originally posted by fmarek fmarek wrote:


If this is correct then 87g
Do you really want to play 190g racket!?

P.S. Btw none of my rubbers taken from Viscaria (157x150) cover full surface of Primorac. Primorac head is bigger, right?


 
How much does glue and edge tape weigh?

I use medium layer of glue on each surface. Somewhere around 4-5 g. With tape is 5. 

I can comfortably handle 190g. For the last 2 months I played 193g. However from last week I started doing more advanced BH training and immediately felt that 193g is too much for BH. God rid of tape and also made rubbers even with the blade (I had some bevel around, so could cut it out). I am sporty but small build. If you are big then 187 - 190 should be fine.
Stiga Celero, FH: 729 08-ES H47, BH: Yinhe Jupiter 2, H38
Yinhe Kiso 5ply, FH: 729 08-ES H47, BH: Hurricane 3 Commercial H39
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  123>
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 12.01
Copyright ©2001-2018 Web Wiz Ltd.

This page was generated in 0.078 seconds.

Become a Fan on Facebook Follow us on Twitter Web Wiz News
About MyTableTennis.NET | Forum Help | Disclaimer

MyTableTennis.NET is the trading name of Alex Table Tennis Ltd.

Copyright ©2003-2019 Alex Table Tennis Ltd. All rights reserved.