Alex Table Tennis - MyTableTennis.NET Homepage
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Innerforce ZLF vs Liu shiwen
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

Innerforce ZLF vs Liu shiwen

 Post Reply Post Reply
Author
oliverpink View Drop Down
Member
Member
Avatar

Joined: 02/12/2011
Location: Ilford
Status: Offline
Points: 9
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oliverpink Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Innerforce ZLF vs Liu shiwen
    Posted: 08/23/2012 at 8:11pm
differences ?
Back to Top
Sponsored Links


Back to Top
silva7 View Drop Down
Silver Member
Silver Member
Avatar

Joined: 03/14/2012
Location: New Zealand
Status: Offline
Points: 693
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote silva7 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/23/2012 at 10:15pm
i do not own a Liu Shiwen myself but i have an IF ZLF and the only difference i can identify between the two is the handle size. IF ZLF has a slightly smaller handle.
i think the differences between these two blades are the same as Viscaria and ZJK or Zhang Yining and IF ZLC.
RSM Special Platinum T64
Back to Top
Imago View Drop Down
Premier Member
Premier Member
Avatar

Joined: 07/19/2009
Location: Sofia
Status: Offline
Points: 5897
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Imago Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/24/2012 at 1:56am
IF ZLF are very different from blade to blade, probably more different than LSW is. LSW is however a fast blade, at least faster than ZJK and IF ZLF. Handle is bigger, yes.
Back to Top
Mickael View Drop Down
Silver Member
Silver Member
Avatar

Joined: 10/30/2011
Location: World
Status: Offline
Points: 794
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mickael Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/24/2012 at 5:11pm
I played all of the mentioned blades. Viscaria and zjk are identical only difference is the handle and the shape near the handle. LSW and ifzlf are the same, with liu shiwen name for marketing purposes that is all. And you can be 100% sure that zjk/viscaria are way faster than LSW/ifzlf.
Nittaku Acoustic Carbon FL
Butterfly Dignics 05 2.1 FH
Butterfly Dignics 05 2.1 BH
Back to Top
Baal View Drop Down
Forum Moderator
Forum Moderator


Joined: 01/21/2010
Location: unknown
Status: Offline
Points: 14335
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/24/2012 at 6:03pm
Actually even though the composition seems to be the same, I did not like ZJK blade at all (after years of owning and playing with Viscaria).  Maybe I just got a bad one, but I have never had a bad Viscaria (have owned five over the years).  I think the ZJK may be made in a different factory, or they are gluing them differently, or something.  But yes, Viscaria and ZJK are a lot faster than IF ZLF.
Back to Top
VladiTT View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member
Avatar
Post #57918

Joined: 06/23/2012
Location: BG
Status: Offline
Points: 267
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VladiTT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/25/2012 at 8:12am
maybe this is just my thought,but i see that new blades are low quality build ...
Back to Top
ejmaster View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar

Joined: 08/09/2009
Location: madrid
Status: Offline
Points: 2609
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ejmaster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/25/2012 at 8:02pm
Originally posted by Baal Baal wrote:

Actually even though the composition seems to be the same, I did not like ZJK blade at all (after years of owning and playing with Viscaria).  Maybe I just got a bad one, but I have never had a bad Viscaria (have owned five over the years).  I think the ZJK may be made in a different factory, or they are gluing them differently, or something.  But yes, Viscaria and ZJK are a lot faster than IF ZLF.
 
it is not that you get a bad one. it is like this.
EJ Club.

MM T05(fh)/Srvfx(bh); InfVps,LSW,Viscaria,RwV,TBAlc,PG7,yextsc,yeo. EJmaster wood.
Back to Top
tsanyc View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar

Joined: 05/23/2006
Location: Mt. Hinoki
Status: Offline
Points: 2367
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tsanyc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/25/2012 at 9:54pm
IF ZLF is too woody imho, LSW feels just right. 
I've LSW before, it has really good feeling for loop/hit/chop/serve.  Too bad they don't make straight handle one.
Back to Top
Mickael View Drop Down
Silver Member
Silver Member
Avatar

Joined: 10/30/2011
Location: World
Status: Offline
Points: 794
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mickael Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/26/2012 at 5:45am
Hahaha, they are exactly the same. When I first saw the lsw blade I didn't believe that someone would be trapped, the marketing worked for them people GOT confused. They are both limba outer, Zlf, and innerfiber. Thickness 5.6 head h:152 and w:158. Like sk7 is like krbel sk7 ( I also got trapped). Viscaria like zjk. Tbs like tb alc with 1 mm diff in thickness ( note that tbs has a lot better feel). It is all about marketing when you put a name on the blade an unknown blade would become a best seller.
Nittaku Acoustic Carbon FL
Butterfly Dignics 05 2.1 FH
Butterfly Dignics 05 2.1 BH
Back to Top
alborz View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member
Avatar

Joined: 06/23/2012
Location: Tehran
Status: Offline
Points: 274
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote alborz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/26/2012 at 8:01am
I agree you Mickael .
Back to Top
Baal View Drop Down
Forum Moderator
Forum Moderator


Joined: 01/21/2010
Location: unknown
Status: Offline
Points: 14335
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/26/2012 at 12:34pm
Mickael, although the dimensions are the same, and the composition is the same, the ZJK plays like crap compared to Viscaria.  I've now tried a couple of them (ZJKs) and I really hate them, and it's not just in my head.  There are aspects of blade construction that are not obvious from materials and specs, such as how the plies are glued together, and I believe that the ZJK is now built in a factory in China.  Whatever they are doing, something is markedly different.  As for LSW versus ILF, I have no idea.  They very well could be identical.  And I completely agree with you about TBS and TB-ALC.  I think both of those are also much much better than the ZJK.   I think they made a similar thickness change in Viscaria when they went from the old badges to the new ones, as the newer versions are definitely thicker (and I like them better, personally, although it may be just that I am used to it now).  ALso, if the ZJK was identical to the Viscaria, then ZJK would use it!
Back to Top
AndySmith View Drop Down
Premier Member
Premier Member
Avatar

Joined: 11/12/2008
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 4378
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AndySmith Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/26/2012 at 4:13pm
Originally posted by Baal Baal wrote:

Mickael, although the dimensions are the same, and the composition is the same, the ZJK plays like crap compared to Viscaria.  I've now tried a couple of them (ZJKs) and I really hate them, and it's not just in my head.  There are aspects of blade construction that are not obvious from materials and specs, such as how the plies are glued together, and I believe that the ZJK is now built in a factory in China.  Whatever they are doing, something is markedly different.  As for LSW versus ILF, I have no idea.  They very well could be identical.  And I completely agree with you about TBS and TB-ALC.  I think both of those are also much much better than the ZJK.   I think they made a similar thickness change in Viscaria when they went from the old badges to the new ones, as the newer versions are definitely thicker (and I like them better, personally, although it may be just that I am used to it now).  ALso, if the ZJK was identical to the Viscaria, then ZJK would use it!

The ZJK is labelled as made in Japan. I don't see any reason to doubt that yet. 

I use the LSW now, and really like it. I tried the I-ZLF for a bit to compare, but not for long. They are very, very close. The handles are different, and I found the LSW a bit more comfortable in the hand. I guess the shape of the handle, and the neck area, could produce some differences between the two, but if so, they are very subtle. I think they are both good blades, but overpriced for what they are really. 
This was a great signature until I realised it was overrated.
Back to Top
slevin View Drop Down
Premier Member
Premier Member


Joined: 03/15/2012
Location: USA
Status: Offline
Points: 3602
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote slevin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/08/2013 at 12:36pm
Brief report: I had both the Innerforce ZLF (84g, FL) & the Liu Shiwen (86g, FL).

I decided to keep the LSW from the two.

Despite their having identical characteristics on paper (barring the handle, that is), I find the LSW to be a bit harder, stiffer & faster than the IF-ZLF. Spin generation capability is still intensely high as is customary for most Zylon blades.

IMO, relative to the TB-ALC, this blade offers much better performance on the 1st 3-4 balls of each point. The other well-known composites (TBS, Viscaria, IF-ZLC, JM, etc) retain an edge at mid-distance play.
Back to Top
the_theologian View Drop Down
Premier Member
Premier Member
Avatar

Joined: 01/11/2009
Location: U.S.
Status: Offline
Points: 3895
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote the_theologian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/08/2013 at 1:25pm
@Baal

I hate to see the trend of reputable tt companies covertly having some products made on the cheap and selling them at a premium; such as Donic and the Traction rubbers (Haifu)
Appelgren Allplay ST / Vega Europe max
Back to Top
Baal View Drop Down
Forum Moderator
Forum Moderator


Joined: 01/21/2010
Location: unknown
Status: Offline
Points: 14335
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/08/2013 at 2:49pm
Theol  In the year that has passed since I wrote that, I have learned that the ZJK  blades are still made in Japan.  I don't know what Donic might be doing.  Don't discount the value of determining the appropriate specs for the design.
Back to Top
assiduous View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar

Joined: 05/01/2011
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2521
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote assiduous Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/08/2013 at 4:21pm
i played with a couple of ZJK blades. I have and like a TBS, and have played a lot with TB ZLC. Those are stiff and hard blades, crisp, but still have good feel. 
ZJK is the stiffest, most dead-felt blade I have tried. No feedback at all. I have not played with Viscaria but I sure did dislike the ZJK blades a lot, and  I am one of the bigges ZJK fans out there.
puppy412 : Sorry man, I don't mean to sound disrespectful, but I know that more training will make me better, I don't need to come here to figure that out
Back to Top
Baal View Drop Down
Forum Moderator
Forum Moderator


Joined: 01/21/2010
Location: unknown
Status: Offline
Points: 14335
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/08/2013 at 5:05pm
Assiduous, I have owned tons of Viscarias, and have played with at least three different samples of the original ZJKs (owned only one).  Viiscaria and original ZJK are amazingly different considering they are supposedly made of the same stuff, and I don't like the ZJK at all.  I am not sure  that I would use the terms "stiff" or "dead" in the sense of being slow or something, although maybe we are describing the same thing.  It is like with the ZJK blade they took the ALC lack of vibration to an absurd limit to the point where there is basically no feedback at all.

In my experience, Viscaria is the softest one of the group I think, usually, also the most flexible. It is more like TBS than the others you mention. 

I think the difference  has something to do with the newer blades having some sort of treatment of the upper ply that makes it shinier and harder. 

The newer versions of ZJK blades seem better to me than the first one with the blue dragon.

I have to also say that the Viscarias that I have seen an played with that have been made in the last year or so have a slightly different feel than they used to.  Or maybe my older ones have just aged nicely.
Back to Top
Lightzy View Drop Down
Super Member
Super Member
Avatar

Joined: 09/18/2017
Location: T-A
Status: Offline
Points: 345
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lightzy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09/18/2017 at 9:47pm
Just want to chime in:
I have 2 LSW ZLF blades. One I got as a gift and one I bought when I didn't understand it's a gift and thought it's a lend and wanted to get one for myself :))

One is 92gr with FL handle, the other is 84g with AN handle and they both play very differently for some bizzare reason.

So regarding consistency in blades, that's a whole kettle of fish right there.





Back to Top
timoboll86 View Drop Down
Beginner
Beginner


Joined: 09/20/2017
Location: USA
Status: Offline
Points: 11
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote timoboll86 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09/20/2017 at 6:36am
I have sold my Liushiwen
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 12.01
Copyright ©2001-2018 Web Wiz Ltd.

This page was generated in 0.610 seconds.

Become a Fan on Facebook Follow us on Twitter Web Wiz News
Forum Home | Go to the Forums | Forum Help | Disclaimer

MyTableTennis.NET is the trading name of Alex Table Tennis Ltd.

Copyright ©2003-2024 Alex Table Tennis Ltd. All rights reserved.