poll: why do Chinese pros use tacky rubber?

They all used Friendship or Globe rubbers until the team became sponsored by DHS so they were already using almost identical rubbers, the DHS line are only copies of the 729/Globe rubbers. Right now it's because of money.

I recall reading an interview with one of the CNT coaches where he stressed the importance of short game, and that tacky rubbers are better for it.

This was covered a bit in the Wu Jingping (National Team coach of Ma Lin, Wang Hao, Fan Zhendong) article... pasted the translated section below...

4. Rubber and the loop: Chinese rubber and European/Japanese rubbers are very different and have different characteristics and therefore change the style of the player/shot. Europeans loop more with hit than loop because European rubber topsheet is not tacky, sponge is soft but is bouncy. If you use Euro/Jap rubbers, the ball must sink into the sponge and dwell so that you have more control over the spin and speed of the incoming ball. (ie. Not as sensitive to spin). This is even better because more Europeans are taller and more powerful than the Chinese players. Chinese players brush the ball more especially since their rubbers (in particular Hurricane series) are tackier and the ball doesn't sink into the sponge much. This makes the rubber and blade combination fast. Because there is more brushing, the quality of the loop is better.


Also adding the section where he explains the difference between the Euro/Asian loop styles to give more insight on how the rubber affects the loop quality...

We can split forehand topspin into two different kinds: European style and Asian style. European style forehand demands more hitting than brushing therefore the end loop is one that is fast, powerful and low. Asian style forehand demands more brush therefore when the ball bounces off the other side of the table it jumps. It is also fast and low but has more spin. Because this technique has been in development for so many years, many players have a composite style forehand and it usually not 100% clear whether they have a completely Asian or European forehand.

Edited by Rack - 12/15/2013 at 6:29am

More dwell time, giving less margin for error, and the hard gives them controlled speed with tacky.

IMHO, Rack's answer is right, it's mainly due to the stroke and short receive.  

The right answer, IMO, is that it is what they use in China when starting out and that they use it as kids and continue to use it as adults.  If we had a Chinese junior male champ raised on Tenergy, that might change.  I believe some CNT training partners like Li Ping do use Euro-Jap rubbers, but I really believe that the short game answers, while having validity, are not as important as having be raised on that stuff and not being willing to spend the time to adapt to Euro-Jap stuff,

I think it is like the old Penhold V Shakehand question.

seguso wrote: "why don't they use a rubber which is as hard as DHS rubbers, but nontacky?".

Like Grip-S RS, which is non-tacky but otherwise is a replica of H3 or probably TG3 as it feels harder than H3. I tried today a new black Grip-S with red H2 Neo on HK2 signature edition. H2 Neo feels like it is made for this blade, better than H3, better than Grip-S, better even than T05. In this combo, H2 has more spin, more power, and more precision than everything else.

seguso wrote: @bluebucket: you are saying that if DHS did not pay them, they would be using 729? But then the question becomes: why 729, instead of T05, or something NON-TACKY at any rate?

If they had to buy and choose their own I'd guess many would be using 729 or globe rubbers. Why they choose tacky rubber in the first place?. That's just because it's what they know and what they use as kids. Remember also the team rubbers are basically non tacky these days

bluebucket wrote:   Remember also the team rubbers are basically non tacky these days

What are "team rubbers"? You mean Ma Long, FZD, XX are really using nontacky rubbers?

I'd say the best way to find out is to use both of them by yourself (boosted tacky and tenergy) with same blade for some time.
that will give you a great idea on all the differences.

I suspect Tinykin has it right.  People have been using these kinds of rubber in China forever (from one Chinese company or another), and probably most if not all top players learned to play using them.  Price matters still in most of China --although obviously not once players reach a certain level on their road to the national team.  If you learn to use those rubbers, obviously they can be incredibly effective.  I have never had the patience to figure it out myself, but I pretty much learned to play using Mark V.  If you have used European/Japanese rubber for a long time, tacky hard Chinese rubbers feel really really strange.  Of course, the top players have boosted them like crazy, and I have never tried one that has been treated like that.  Maybe with boosting they are more like I am used to. 

I think the Chinese National team coaches and players are constantly trying new solutions, checking if some new material or technique can be used more effectively. And once discovered, there is great incentive for players to adopt new materials and techniques, to get an edge over opponents. For example, look at Ma Long: he learned to loop the bh, then to banana flip. He could not always do that. Even forehand counterloop at the table, where you have to crouch instead of moving farther, is a relatively new discovery, which Ma Long has integrated only recently in his game. (And XX and ZJK haven't yet)

The same holds for materials: Ma Long and others are constantly experimenting as we know. Just look at the recent episode with Yan An and T05Fx.

For these reasons I believe that, if T05 on fh (for example) could produce more effective strokes with a different technique, Ma Long and others would adopt them and change their technique accordingly. The incentive for them to do it is just too big: they risk getting surpassed by newer players.

That's why I don't buy the explanation "they are using tacky just because that's what they started with / what they've always used".


Edited by seguso - 12/15/2013 at 1:41pm

In my humble opinion. I feel there are a few reasons but mostly because it is better at serving, short pushing, and with proper technique it can handle backspin and dead balls a little better. All of these situations take place close to the table which is trademark of the Chinese style of play. Eurojap rubbers handle incoming topspin easier and Chinese rubber offers no advantage with incoming topspin but since the majority of rallies (especially with Chinese players) are concluded before topspin rallies begin, Chinese players feel the aforementioned close to the table advantages are worth it. Speed gluing also helps minimize the disadvantage Chinese rubbers have against incoming topsin.

Tinykin wrote: I think it is like the old Penhold V Shakehand question. People play how they were initially taught and with the equipment they were given. I think most Chinese use the Chinese rubbers because that is what they started with. It is only relatively recently that an ordinary Chinese player could even think about affording a Euro/Jap rubber and/or blade.