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Stiga Genesis M and Mantra M review.

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    Posted: 03/20/2017 at 11:38pm
Stiga genesis M
I have a chance to try genesis rubber on FH black.
A blade is borrowed from my good friend. At 2-3 day session.

Impression : Top definitely Chinese like tackiness, sponge is orange like tin arc. The rubber is way faster than traditional chinese rubber. Sponge and top sheet sync really well it's A BRAVO from Stiga they have miss for many year. Quite low and long trajectory. Though having chinese top sheet, this rubber is lively on medium to high power stroke all you need to do is brush!! I can't rate spin power and control in number I don't usually play with chinese rubber.

In short - fast and lively chinese rubber.

Stiga Mantra M
I borrowed stiga clipper CC with Mantra M on both side.
Mantra is WOW, Stiga finally make something worth buying. (Airoc series are DOOM)
I dare to say it's something in between ELS - MXP.
Characteristic is close to thibhar ELS in hardness and feel but what make this rubber great is over all power is better. Grippy behavior easy to generate spin of serving. Less bouncy behavior than MXP but very lively in most of circumstance Rubber has very high quality in both surface and sponge. Nothing to say much.

In short -  every one should try Mantra M. ( Though people argue Europe of Japanese) Good grippy non tacky rubber. I give 1M thumps up for this rubber.


Anyway we should observe durability. I hope it long last.


Next EJs, Yasaka Valmo, I will receive a free sample soon.





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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kolev Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03/21/2017 at 4:52am
Since a month ago I am testing Mantra H and so far I'm impressed. Great for my FH, with a higher than T64 throw , about the same speed and a better control
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Saitama Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03/21/2017 at 5:20am
Originally posted by Kolev Kolev wrote:

Since a month ago I am testing Mantra H and so far I'm impressed. Great for my FH, with a higher than T64 throw , about the same speed and a better control

+1

had the same impressions about mantra h




Edited by Saitama - 03/21/2017 at 5:21am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Crowsfeather Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03/21/2017 at 9:38pm
I sould try Mantra H

But soon.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Coppa2000 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03/23/2017 at 6:20am
I have only tried Mantra M so far and as you I also like it a lot! I have it on my backhand and thinking about starting using it on forehand too, it depends on how it is holding up. I have only uses it for three weeks but awesome rubber so far! Can someone compare the feeling between M and H?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote siestakey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03/23/2017 at 8:09am

   Couldn't feel much difference , according to Stiga's specs M/H = Control 77/77 Speed 155/156 Spin 132 ?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03/23/2017 at 9:47am
Originally posted by siestakey siestakey wrote:


   Couldn't feel much difference , according to Stiga's specs M/H = Control 77/77 Speed 155/156 Spin 132 ?

yes, that's what it states on the packaging.  Hard to believe the speed is almost the same.  Will do a verification this Friday night and check the hardness by hand as well.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote emihet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03/23/2017 at 4:30pm
how is the spin compared with MXP
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Saitama Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03/23/2017 at 5:32pm
SPIN: MXP > Mantra H
SPEED: MXP < Mantra H

Tried mxp and mantra h at the same time for weeks now.

Edited by Saitama - 03/23/2017 at 6:52pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kunglao Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03/25/2017 at 2:12pm
Tried mantra h after hearing about it on this forum. THIS RIBBER IS NOT GOOD!   I. Don't know what level the previous reviewer is but that rubber is nothing special at all. Spin!and speed is mediocre, feels very hard and dead. If u liked blue fire and other euro type rubbers, you won't like this! The feel is terrible, feedback is non existent.   Sorry but my expectations were higher so I'm thoroughly disappointed. The blue fires, rasants are much better.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Saitama Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03/25/2017 at 6:01pm
@kunglao do you have a Mantra H? I might agree with you for a bit there. At first moments with the Mantra H I got that impression also but after a few sessions I cant say it is not a good rubber.. Take your time with it. Im pretty sure you'll enjoy it
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/04/2017 at 2:00pm
love the Mantra H and M.  I have a black Mantra 1.9 on the FH.  After less than 2 months of usage the topsheet starts to lose the shine that the new sheets have and whatever remains is uneven -  kind of streaky.  I can't complain about the performance.  Has any body else experienced this or have any thought on whether the topsheet losing its shine means anything?  
BTW I have a red 2.1 M on the backhand used for the same time - but with a little less usage - the shine on it looks fine.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kolev Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/04/2017 at 7:18pm
I wouldn't​ describe the top sheet of my Mantra H as shiny. For me it is matt, very smooth matt indeed. Yes, in the beginning I had the thought that it may be a bit hard, but not anymore. I hope it will maintain it's unusual grippiness for a long time to come
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Crowsfeather Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/04/2017 at 10:47pm
Mantra is not shiny at all, but Fresh new Genesis is.
Mantra top sheet is less grippy than Evo by notch, but overall is still grippy.
Spin generation is easy.
I'm no longer an EJ and I'm proud .
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/05/2017 at 10:04am
  matte or shiny is relative, the shine I am talking about is a quality that reflect light off the  rubber surface - kind of tiny sparkles.  it still might not be clear - but I can't explain it any better. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote icontek Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/05/2017 at 10:31pm
You mean matte. Matt is my name and not a description of a finish ;)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote p1ngp0ng3r Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/06/2017 at 4:05am
I'm a both wing looper , not playing agressively but relying on spin and placement of the ball. 

Using the Mantra M 2.0mm for multiple weeks on both BH and FH. I really enjoy this rubber. It has decent speed and packs a bunch of spin as well. Sometimes a bit unpredictable in short play and the high speed surprised me sometimes. So you could say, the control could be better. Currently using the Celero blade with these rubbers and I love this combination! The Celero is not a fast blade, but provides much control and compensates the 2 things I mentioned before.

Also tried the Genesis by the way. Didn't like it that much, as it lacks some catapult. Control is very good and I would describe the Genesis as a perfect rubber for blocking and pushes.

@Kunglao, I have played couple of months with Bluefire M and Acuda Blue P2 and prefer Mantra M. Playing TT for over 25 years at a decent regional level in my country. Liking of a rubber is purely personal ofcourse. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Crowsfeather Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/07/2017 at 3:46am
Dear Kunglao, My review could miss-leading you for buying the rubber. 
BF and Rasant has more of the things(catapult) that greatly help you generate power.
Mantra may be a little less but I still confirm it's a powerful rubber.
Please be patient with mantra and you will love it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote richrf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/20/2017 at 10:57am
This is an older thread. I'm looking at purchasing one of these rubbers. Anyone else try them out and found some love? If so, composite or wood?

Edited by richrf - 10/20/2017 at 10:57am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/20/2017 at 11:09am
I have used both.  They are very different rubbers.  What qualities are you looking for and on what blade?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote richrf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/20/2017 at 11:17am
Originally posted by tom tom wrote:

I have used both.  They are very different rubbers.  What qualities are you looking for and on what blade?


Hi Tom, thanks

Right now I'm using Calibra LT, which is medium hard, on a older Killerspin Diamond CQ composite, OFF-, which needs replacing. The Diamond CQ is no longer sold as a blade so unfortunately I have to switch to another blade.

Everything is fine with this setup other than I have to work hard to create spin with Calibra which i can't on a sustained basis. As a counterexample, it is easy for me to create soon with a Tenergy 05-FX but I don't have the same feeling and control that I have with Calibra. So I'm looking for some upgrade in spin without sacrificing too much speed.

Appreciate any feedback on the differences between the two rubbers. I'm definitely trying to avoid any excessive catapult and also looking for durability.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote tom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/20/2017 at 12:03pm
Richrf, Have to  check the Genesis M for the qualities you are looking for tonight.  I have not tried the Calibra LT or the 05-FX so I can't compare them to the interested rubbers.  I could tell you the Mantra M is decent on spin and speed but has better control than the previous generation of ESN rubbers like Rasant Grip.  I could return more of the opponent's power shots with the Mantra.  I can't really rate it's durability as I haven't wore one out due to my recent experimentation with Chinese rubbers, but I doubt it is very durable as I have not experience any recent ESN rubbers that really last.  If you are looking for spin and the last generation of ESN rubbers, I think the Thibar Aurus Select has more spin on medium (and lower) speed loops (I use it on BH).  Mantra and Aurus have lower catapult than Rasant Grip.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote richrf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/20/2017 at 12:31pm
Thanks Tom.

As far as I understand, Mantra M is a tension Japanese rubber, and not ESN, and may even be coming out of the same factory that makes the Calibra. I generally prefer Japanese tension to ESN because I feel more control and they seem to be lighter.

Genesis I believe it's manufactured in China with a more of a hybrid feel. What makes me consider Genesis is that the pro on the Table Tennis Daily video who tests many of the popular rubbers is actually using Genesis for his league play.

Thanks for the info and help!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote tom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/20/2017 at 1:00pm
Originally posted by richrf richrf wrote:

Thanks Tom.

As far as I understand, Mantra M is a tension Japanese rubber, and not ESN, and may even be coming out of the same factory that makes the Calibra. I generally prefer Japanese tension to ESN because I feel more control and they seem to be lighter.

Genesis I believe it's manufactured in China with a more of a hybrid feel. What makes me consider Genesis is that the pro on the Table Tennis Daily video who tests many of the popular rubbers is actually using Genesis for his league play.

Thanks for the info and help!

You are right regarding the Mantra / ESN (I forgot).  I still stand by it's durability as a sheet of the H lost its sheen (see my previous posts on this thread) rather quickly.  Will get back to you on the Genesis.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote tom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/20/2017 at 10:09pm
richrf,found out the Genesis M is not mounted and did not have enough time to fix it up before my practice tonight .  if nobody else gives you a comparison between the two by my next practice (Monday) i will mount it on a AVX BT777 with a Mantra M on the other side to make a direct comparison.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote richrf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/20/2017 at 10:11pm
Originally posted by tom tom wrote:

richrf,found out the Genesis M is not mounted and did not have enough time to fix it up before my practice tonight .  if nobody else gives you a comparison between the two by my next practice (Monday) i will mount it on a AVX BT777 with a Mantra M on the other side to make a direct comparison.


Thanks Tom. That's will be great!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote tom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/24/2017 at 12:09am
richrf, mounted a Genesis M max and a Mantra M 1.9 on a 7 ply wood Andro Wanokwani Ren Off (I think a off- to off blade).  What I can tell you so far the Mantra is about 10% faster (and would be enough for most players).  Loop against topspin M is faster and has more bite on the ball.  Topspin off heavy downspin,  G is just slightly easier and the difference in spin is  minimal. neither have any difficulties but neither creates the same level of spin as MXP.  G is about 12% bouncier (than M) but I would say is not overly so.  If you want any other characteristics I could try to find out Wed.
















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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote richrf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/24/2017 at 12:25am
Originally posted by tom tom wrote:

richrf, mounted a Genesis M max and a Mantra M 1.9 on a 7 ply wood Andro Wanokwani Ren Off (I think a off- to off blade).  What I can tell you so far the Mantra is about 10% faster (and would be enough for most players).  Loop against topspin M is faster and has more bite on the ball.  Topspin off heavy downspin,  G is just slightly easier and the difference in spin is  minimal. neither have any difficulties but neither creates the same level of spin as MXP.  G is about 12% bouncier (than M) but I would say is not overly so.  If you want any other characteristics I could try to find out Wed.


That's perfect Tom. Thanks much!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Vlad0 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/24/2017 at 5:04am
I bought Genesis M black max finally. Last night i tried it on Viscaria. The topsheet is shiny and not tacky at all, even pressing the ball. The sponge is definitely red and not orange (more red than that will be purple) and i would say it's hard - harder than T05, reminds me of MXS when my partner used it. The arc is low and not high as some say and long - again MXS ??? BH - too long but it's about technique for sure, FH - perfect. In matchplay i found that every mistake is on the BH side, but maybe because H3 went there and none on the FH side. Amazing. Just like in the clip of TTD. You can open EVERY ball easy with slow spiny loop landing behind the net and ready for the winner. You can control the speed of the ball easy (hello blockers Wink). As it is said - between euro and Chinese rubber - perfect for me. No more dead Chinese rubber on the FH Big smile.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/24/2017 at 10:38am
Originally posted by richrf richrf wrote:

Originally posted by tom tom wrote:

richrf, mounted a Genesis M max and a Mantra M 1.9 on a 7 ply wood Andro Wanokwani Ren Off (I think a off- to off blade).  What I can tell you so far the Mantra is about 10% faster (and would be enough for most players).  Loop against topspin M is faster and has more bite on the ball.  Topspin off heavy downspin,  G is just slightly easier and the difference in spin is  minimal. neither have any difficulties but neither creates the same level of spin as MXP.  G is about 12% bouncier (than M) but I would say is not overly so.  If you want any other characteristics I could try to find out Wed.


That's perfect Tom. Thanks much!
richrf, I meant M is 12% bouncier than G
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