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Estimation of USATT Ranking

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dream1700 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/25/2017 at 12:52pm
The girl will be 2200 in a few years.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote benfb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/25/2017 at 2:08pm
Originally posted by infernowasif34 infernowasif34 wrote:

Thanks for the reply. Any constructive criticism?
I'm going to skip the part about guessing ratings, which is a fun game but won't help you.

First problem is that you need how to chop properly.  You do a very short stroke and most "real" chopping involves a much longer stroke.  Look at some videos and see if you can find a consistent looper to practice with.  Or use a robot.  You really need to train that chopping technique for hours and hours.

Aborted chops (short swings) don't do much and force you to play an 'in between game": not quite a true defender, not attacking either.

Second problem is footwork.  Footwork is critical to chopping n order to get in place properly.  You need to have the footwork to be move, then be balanced for your stroke so that you can move again.  It's each to cheat on footwork (up to 1700 level) if you're just hitting topspin near the table.  But if you're chopping from off the table, footwork means everything.

It's hard to worry about anything else while you have those two issues.  It will take time to improve both stroke and footwork, so be patient with yourself.  I would worry less about playing games right now and more about just putting in the hours at strokes and footwork.

Good luck and Merry Christmas!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BRS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/25/2017 at 2:35pm
+1 on footwork. You get off balance after every shot, and that isn't good.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rocketman222 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/25/2017 at 9:12pm
Still think around 1650-1750
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote benfb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/25/2017 at 9:28pm
Originally posted by rocketman222 rocketman222 wrote:

Still think around 1650-1750
For the OP/chopper? Not from that video, not even close.

I'll be the first to admit that videos make us look much worse, so I don't know that I could really guess his level from these videos.  But we have a low-level chopper in our club whose footwork and strokes are much superior to OP and our guy's rating is around 1500.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JacekGM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/25/2017 at 9:53pm
Being rated a little over 1200 at that time (good East Coast Club), I got a chance to play a 1900 colleague in a practice match. Dave is a real 1900, and probably should be much more, quite a tall guy, moves well, has a great feel for the ball, just maybe becomes a little impatient if a good player sends him a lot of underspin balls. His service is easy, a type that never likes to win with just the serve. Who am I to judge... Anyways, a few years ago I got to play him, on a good day of mine. I played with TBS with T80 both sides at that time (cannot do this any more due to joint issues). I lost 1:3, with a couple my lost games very close (like 12:14). There were moments that the spectators actually loudly applauded my play. Might be my best match ever. The funny part is this: a new guy came to the club that night, he saw the match; later I invited him to play and he refused saying that he is not my level, no irony there. A couple weeks later I found out he is 1400. 

This long and boring story is given here to illustrate that at lower levels it is possible to play a fairly good match (darn, I never record...) that is a far distant from your usual level. If you record that, and then publish, well...Wink you may not get the type of criticism you actually need.


Edited by JacekGM - 12/25/2017 at 9:53pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mickd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/26/2017 at 3:58am
That little girl is going to be a strong force within a few years!

I remember when one of my students was first learning to cut, she was doing this exercise to help with going close and away from the table.

Simply put, it was just her being in the ready position, taking a step back, chopping a ball fed to her by another student, then stepping in back to the ready position. She repeated that over and over, quicker and quicker.

What I liked about how they did it was that she had her towel on the table in the middle on the back edge. Whenever she went back into the ready position, she physically touched her racket head on the towel.

I would recommend that if you can get someone to feed you balls or consistently loop balls to you. If they're looping balls, you can ask them to push one then loop, push then loop. That way you can practicing getting back into the table and stepping out. My student loves that exercise and it's one she does every day.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote infernowasif34 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/26/2017 at 11:15am
Thanks for the reply guys. The problem with my chopping stroke came from the fact that I practised a lot of FAST multiball with my coach which is why I couldn't really use a long stroke as it would mean the next ball would fly by. I have been practising with a coach for 4 years now, although it has been for two days a week without much dedication from my side. But recently I have been getting more serious and will start to practise for 4 days a week. My coach is the National Champion of Bangladesh but due to the fact that he is so young (around 22) he doesn't know much about playing with LPs (playing against is a different story). It is the same with 99% players and coaches of our country. Every one of them sees LPs as something to compensate for a weak backhand with. My previous coach told me I had a good knack for hitting balls back with LPs which is why I switched, and it was so fun that I never looked back. But alas, the problem of how to play with LPs still remained. So I turned to youtube and forums to know about how to play with LPs. My coaches just gave me an LP and helped me practise but I never knew much about in game strategies. Sorry for the long post.

BOTTOM LINE: I have a coach who doesn't know much about playing with LPs, but he can help me with any kind of practice I want. Thank you for suggesting the problem with my footwork. I am already working on my chopping stroke with much slower multiball. But it will take a bit more time to see results of it in the game as it is a habit I built for over two years. Please suggest drills to cover footwork of backhand chop to forehand counterloop transitioning! Secondly, to the guy who said this might be just a good day I had, I can show you more videos over the next couple of months where I play a similar level, but that's not the main problem here is it?

P.S rocketman thanks for rating me so highly against all the odds xD
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jpenmaster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/26/2017 at 12:03pm
I would make the switch to inverted on the BH. There will be growing pains but it will give you best chance for growth due to your coaching situation. If you want to stick with LP spend a lot of time on the OOAK forum . With such a short bh stroke maybe you would be better off with a pushblock type style .
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote infernowasif34 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/26/2017 at 12:09pm
I'm definitely not giving up. Especially not after resolving to get a good amount of practice every week. Nah I'm not going to play a pushblock style, the ultimate style I aspire to get is the Gionis/Filus style. Thanks for your suggestion though!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote infernowasif34 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/26/2017 at 12:14pm
P.S I played inverted BH for two years before switching to LP for two years. My backhand loop and block is still a bit consistent although not as much. But Table Tennis has been way more fun after I switched to LP.

Edited by infernowasif34 - 12/26/2017 at 12:15pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/26/2017 at 1:01pm
Originally posted by infernowasif34 infernowasif34 wrote:

P.S I played inverted BH for two years before switching to LP for two years. My backhand loop and block is still a bit consistent although not as much. But Table Tennis has been way more fun after I switched to LP.


Definitely if it fits your personality.   And my guess is that you beat certain players more. Don't underestimate the issues with not having a coach. But I wouldn't underestimate the fun either unless it is tied to winning as winning stops as soon as most opponents adjust to the changes in ball reads they have to make. But if you can find someone to mentor or coach you that helps a lot.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pgpg Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/26/2017 at 1:29pm
Originally posted by infernowasif34 infernowasif34 wrote:

Thanks for the reply guys. The problem with my chopping stroke came from the fact that I practised a lot of FAST multiball with my coach which is why I couldn't really use a long stroke as it would mean the next ball would fly by. I have been practising with a coach for 4 years now, although it has been for two days a week without much dedication from my side. But recently I have been getting more serious and will start to practise for 4 days a week. My coach is the National Champion of Bangladesh but due to the fact that he is so young (around 22) he doesn't know much about playing with LPs (playing against is a different story). It is the same with 99% players and coaches of our country. Every one of them sees LPs as something to compensate for a weak backhand with. My previous coach told me I had a good knack for hitting balls back with LPs which is why I switched, and it was so fun that I never looked back. But alas, the problem of how to play with LPs still remained. So I turned to youtube and forums to know about how to play with LPs. My coaches just gave me an LP and helped me practise but I never knew much about in game strategies. Sorry for the long post.

BOTTOM LINE: I have a coach who doesn't know much about playing with LPs, but he can help me with any kind of practice I want. Thank you for suggesting the problem with my footwork. I am already working on my chopping stroke with much slower multiball. But it will take a bit more time to see results of it in the game as it is a habit I built for over two years. Please suggest drills to cover footwork of backhand chop to forehand counterloop transitioning! Secondly, to the guy who said this might be just a good day I had, I can show you more videos over the next couple of months where I play a similar level, but that's not the main problem here is it?

P.S rocketman thanks for rating me so highly against all the odds xD

Have a look at the video below, where ~2200 (or even higher?) chopper (forum member 'leatherback', at least on OOAK) is practicing with ~2800 coach. Not exactly your situation, but I suspect Eugene Wang does not necessarily know  a lot about LP strokes either, but he's VERY good against choppers (find his match against Jian Li, whose videos you probably should also watch). It might give you some idea on how fast 'multiball' should be with your coach, and also what LP strokes should look like (I find watching non-pros more useful in general).  


P.S. Did you use black rubbers on both sides in your second video, against 10-yr old girl? That probably helped you here somewhat (well, you still lost Wink)


Edited by pgpg - 12/26/2017 at 1:32pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote infernowasif34 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/26/2017 at 1:33pm
I think I'm on my own with game strategies and strokes. But as Ive said, I can get all the practice I want, so I plan on doing just that for sometime and see where I go.No, I don't win more against certain player. As a matter of fact, the second string junior players (whem they play fellow inverted loopers I think they are 1500+ AT LEAST) like me, beat me in practice all the time. My winning percentage was much lower. But, in a recent inter-school tournament I beat thwm and became the champion. The irony is, it had more to do with them getting nervous about playing against long pips and me seeing that as the perfect opportunity to pickhit. I won that tournament as a pickhitter, not as a modern defender. But this definitely won't work against the first string junior players the best among them being 2000+ easily. So yeah basically I'm more or less screwed xD
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote infernowasif34 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/26/2017 at 1:39pm
Yeah watched him before and read his entire thread about training in China. Thanks for the suggestions! Yeah I used two black rubbers because I used the Ross Leidy blade for the first time back then. They only had one black Tenergy 05 fx in the shop(which doubles as academy) and I had a black tsp p1r only. BUT no, it didn't help at all. I didn't get a single pop up due to LPs. Even when I twiddled the girl saw through it, and of course that's a very good thing considering I didn't have to worry about winning points and making myself looking better (or her) because of that. Secondly, I don't think this comment about rubbers was necessary (not offended though so chill xD).
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Originally posted by infernowasif34 infernowasif34 wrote:

I think I'm on my own with game strategies and strokes. But as Ive said, I can get all the practice I want, so I plan on doing just that for sometime and see where I go.No, I don't win more against certain player. As a matter of fact, the second string junior players (whem they play fellow inverted loopers I think they are 1500+ AT LEAST) like me, beat me in practice all the time. My winning percentage was much lower. But, in a recent inter-school tournament I beat thwm and became the champion. The irony is, it had more to do with them getting nervous about playing against long pips and me seeing that as the perfect opportunity to pickhit. I won that tournament as a pickhitter, not as a modern defender. But this definitely won't work against the first string junior players the best among them being 2000+ easily. So yeah basically I'm more or less screwed xD

You probably are at disadvantage somewhat, but so are many aspiring modern defenders that don't have good defense specialist coach nearby to show them proper strokes, footwork, tactics etc. You are not screwed, though - it sounds like you have plenty of good players to practice against, and quite a few folks here probably envy you already. Smile

Keep looking for videos on YouTube, especially for drills aimed at defenders (I know I saw some). Video yourself to see how your strokes look in reality, and iterate. This forum and OOAK are pretty good at giving advice - I suggest you make your own blog thread at OOAK (not many 'blogs' here, somehow).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pgpg Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/26/2017 at 1:55pm
Originally posted by infernowasif34 infernowasif34 wrote:

Yeah watched him before and read his entire thread about training in China. Thanks for the suggestions! Yeah I used two black rubbers because I used the Ross Leidy blade for the first time back then. They only had one black Tenergy 05 fx in the shop(which doubles as academy) and I had a black tsp p1r only. BUT no, it didn't help at all. I didn't get a single pop up due to LPs. Even when I twiddled the girl saw through it, and of course that's a very good thing considering I didn't have to worry about winning points and making myself looking better (or her) because of that. Secondly, I don't think this comment about rubbers was necessary (not offended though so chill xD).

Huh? Seeing someone playing with same-color rubbers is HIGHLY unusual these days, I'm actually surprised no one mentioned it before in this thread. And it is providing some advantage in the match, since opponent has no visual cues to go by.  Kind of amused by your reaction, but OK.


Edited by pgpg - 12/26/2017 at 1:56pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote infernowasif34 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/26/2017 at 2:01pm
Thanks man! Was just planning on opening a blog, need to get a tripod first xD Yeah I do have good players to practise against, almost all of them can loop consistently against my chops if we are talking single ball bh side to bh side only and I'm mostly the one who lets them down after averaging 3 or 4 hits. We don't have any 'clubs' here at all. Mostly people playing in 3 or 4 places in the city with one table. Only our National Stadium has 4 tables. But all these people have been trained more or less by coaches and you will rarely find a player with no orthodox training in these few small places for Table Tennis. It's 80% training 20% games even for players who rarely show up once a week. Needless to say, the player base and amount of tourneys/leagues is also much much less than other countries. Sorry, just a small rant about my country. But of course, you will find many casual players in schools and homes.

Edited by infernowasif34 - 12/26/2017 at 2:02pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote infernowasif34 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/26/2017 at 2:07pm
I guess I was a little ticked off because I assumed you implied I put up a fight because of the same coloured rubber, sorry about that. And yeah the reason was as I mentioned, but she didn't lose any points because of that I think, at least none that I noticed. Although there might have been a psychological disadvantage but unlikely from the way she played.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/26/2017 at 3:01pm
Originally posted by infernowasif34 infernowasif34 wrote:

I guess I was a little ticked off because I assumed you implied I put up a fight because of the same coloured rubber, sorry about that. And yeah the reason was as I mentioned, but she didn't lose any points because of that I think, at least none that I noticed. Although there might have been a psychological disadvantage but unlikely from the way she played.


Well you can't be ticked off if you broke the rules in a way that puts the opponent at a disadvantage and your opponent was just too good regardless.   It's like using illegal serves but your opponent was so good that it didn't matter or the serves were not good enough so it made no difference. So if you are ticked off, live with it.

Edited by NextLevel - 12/26/2017 at 4:40pm
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Originally posted by pgpg pgpg wrote:

Huh? Seeing someone playing with same-color rubbers is HIGHLY unusual these days, I'm actually surprised no one mentioned it before in this thread. And it is providing some advantage in the match, since opponent has no visual cues to go by.  Kind of amused by your reaction, but OK.
=============
Oops, I did watch the video, but missed that the guy used same color of rubber (black) on both sides.  Thanks for pointing that out.

Shame on that guy.

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Originally posted by skip3119 skip3119 wrote:

Originally posted by pgpg pgpg wrote:

Huh? Seeing someone playing with same-color rubbers is HIGHLY unusual these days, I'm actually surprised no one mentioned it before in this thread. And it is providing some advantage in the match, since opponent has no visual cues to go by.  Kind of amused by your reaction, but OK.
=============
Oops, I did watch the video, but missed that the guy used same color of rubber (black) on both sides.  Thanks for pointing that out.

Shame on that guy.

Interesting anecdote: a week before the US Open, I played in a warm-up tournament.  There was one match I lost to a penhold player in five games.  Afterwards, two different people came up to me and ask me why I didn't complain.  It seems my opponent had black on both sides and was twidling.  I never noticed it.  I did check the rubber on one side before the match but never checked the other side.  After the match, I asked the tournament director about it, but he didn't want to make a deal out of it, so I let it go.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mickd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/26/2017 at 5:53pm
Having the same colour rubbers is a pretty big advantage if your opponent isn't used to it. Maybe she was though. But in the video, I didn't really see you twiddle. Basically, your backhand was all long pips chopping, and your forehand was all attacks. I think that made it easier for her regardless of the same coloured rubbers.

Since you have a coach, I'm confident you'll be able to fit a lot the issues people have mentioned. When I watch my own videos, I always get disappointed when I see myself off balance during shots. I definitely think you should concentrate on staying balanced, especially for backhand to forehand transitions.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote infernowasif34 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/26/2017 at 9:43pm
'Shame on that guy.' Lol what? You are completely missing the point that I glued that rubber from that shop/academy(the girl's coach glued the rubbers and I bought the tenergy from there) and the girl and the coach was fine with me playing with it as I had no other option.

Edit: Sorry I think I didn't mention it before (mixed it up with my ooak post). This is a Table Tennis Shop in Malaysia which doubles as an academy. The girl's coach who was tending to the shop (not the main owner, he is a p1r chopper I heard but sadly didn't get to meet) is a Malaysian National Team Player.

Edited by infernowasif34 - 12/26/2017 at 9:58pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote infernowasif34 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/26/2017 at 9:45pm
Yeah will try and fix it. Do check my blog if I open one in ooak where I'll try and upload videos of sessions with my coach. Thanks!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mickd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/26/2017 at 11:48pm
Looking forward to it! I don't browse ooak, so if you do set it up and post some videos, please post a link here too :)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote skip3119 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/27/2017 at 12:08am
'Shame on that guy.' Lol what? You are completely missing the point .............
=====
That's a ridiculous excuse.
---------
You didn't even say that you used the same colored rubber on both side (and was OKed by your opponent and the umpire) - until somebody caught you red-handed.


Edited by skip3119 - 12/27/2017 at 12:18am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote infernowasif34 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/27/2017 at 12:28am
Yeah mickd sure, will post links. And skip, not sure why you are being so salty and trying to poke me again and again. The issue with the same coloured rubber wasn't even seen as much by any of us,which is why I didn't mention anything, and being caught? LOL. You'd think anyone would see the black rubbers on both sides if I posted clear video, which I did so not sure what made you think I could 'hide' it. In the first place, it was just a casual match I played after putting rubbers on my new blade one of which I bought from the shop. If poking me is all you will do, I won't reply anymore.
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skip3119 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote skip3119 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/27/2017 at 1:37am
Had you mentioned it at the very beginning, nobody would even bother to talk about it.
skip3119
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infernowasif34 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote infernowasif34 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/27/2017 at 1:57am
Yeah, my mistake. I will be very careful not to skip out on any details from now on whenever I post something.
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