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How to improve spin in serves? |
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5370H55V
Beginner Joined: 10/27/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 79 |
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Posted: 03/25/2009 at 1:35am |
So how do I improve spin in my services? Right now most of my serves are fast and deep, with a little back/side spin. They are being easily blocked or looped no matter where I place it. One guy I play with can serve almost as fast as me, but with tons more spin in it. So what's the trick in getting fast spinny serves?
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Hookshot
Gold Member Joined: 07/24/2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1797 |
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Thinner blade angle and fast bat speed = spin.
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cagaragesales
Platinum Member Joined: 10/03/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2023 |
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pinch grip the blade rather than grip it entirely. That way you have more allotted wrist movement for spin.
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wealthweb
Super Member Joined: 03/11/2009 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 291 |
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I am a fans of the Man Lin's ghost serve. I am still practising what a good serve is supposed to be. My coach once told me that I have to rub the ball real hard by swinging and jerking my wrist abrubtly from one direction to another direction at the moment when the ball is in contact with the blade. If you can utilize the ground reaction from where you stand and transfer that energy from the ground to your body, arm, forearm and then your wrist, you should be able to create a tremendous momentum that will cause a severe spin or drive. Relax yourself before you do your serve and only let your wrist energy explode when the blade touches the ball. This is the moment when you should release all your energy at once.
Brothers and sisters, please correct me if I have said something wrong here, because I am still learning and is still considered a rookie while playing at my local table tennis club. Have fun! |
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Eric Yu
1st Blade: KTS Red + Omega II, Tenergy 64 2nd Blade: Butterfly Haruvatart-S ZL Carbon + Omega III, Tenergy 05 Dream Blade:Special Cypress Custom (Special Royal Treasure Art Product)+ Narucr |
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ohhgourami
Platinum Member Joined: 08/12/2008 Location: SoCal Status: Offline Points: 2341 |
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strangely, i get more spin when i grip it entirely. i know theres more potential with pinch grip so im practicing that.
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Custom Walnut 7-ply
DHS H3 Provincial untuned 40° BTY T64 210g |
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bozbrisvegas
Premier Member Joined: 09/27/2008 Location: Behind you Status: Offline Points: 3728 |
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before I answer, What kind of rubber do you use?
what kind of blade do you use?
step 2 almost every rubber can produce lots of spin when it is long.
but not every rubber is that good at short heavy spin.
If this is your aim I suggest making an equipment change. When you are shopping for rubber look at the ratings which say this rubber produces more spin than speed. If you use a rubber which produces more speed than spin, then you can expect that the ball will want to fly forwards more.
If the spin is more than you will realise that you need to put more action on the ball to get over the net and give you the chance to put more spin on it as a result.
Technique is the most important part, but equipment is essential.
For me most people can do a range of long serves with soft backspin sidespin, no spin or topspin long. There arent many players in the lower levels who can really produce tons of backspin. So you can jump level very quickly if you can or are motivated to practise doing short backspin.
I constantly show my friends how to do it and I tell them practise and show me next time, but they never practise!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Basically the ball that you are spinning I imagine you are actually hitting it forward even if you think you are hitting the bottom of it.
I want you to balance the ball on your horizontal blade. See that point where its touching? thats where you contact it. And if you really want it to be super spinny you hit it there and actually finish dragging it upwards.
This is totally different to what I see most people do. They keep showing me there backspin which is hitting the back of the ball.
Do I sound stupid?
most people I know call it BACKSPIN & TOPSPIN
IT SHOULD BE CALLED BOTTOMSPIN & TOPSPIN since these are opposites,
front spin would be virtually impossible
backspin basically would mean either lobbing the ball (if you do an upward stroke) or it means hitting the ball.
So hold the bat horizontal in anyway you like and keep it horizontal all the way attempting to meet the ball in the middle, dont worry about getting as a good serve, just concentrate on getting the ball to come back to you on any table. Dining room table or wooden floor will do, if you cant do this theres no point in trying to make do it low and short with a net in front of you.
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bozbrisvegas
Premier Member Joined: 09/27/2008 Location: Behind you Status: Offline Points: 3728 |
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oh, will you be able to do it overnight? no
will you be able to do it in highpressure situations in the next few months? probably not
Youve just got to practise it everyday...
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ohhgourami
Platinum Member Joined: 08/12/2008 Location: SoCal Status: Offline Points: 2341 |
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unlike your friends, its the only serve i practice. all my other club members use long serves while i use short |
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Custom Walnut 7-ply
DHS H3 Provincial untuned 40° BTY T64 210g |
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bozbrisvegas
Premier Member Joined: 09/27/2008 Location: Behind you Status: Offline Points: 3728 |
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Lastly, the ability to spin as you mentioned (shadow) is all about illusion. The thing people often fail to realise is that it isnt just post swing your arm around like a magician.
It is both specific post and pre serve fakes.
First you need a variety of serves,
For example,
you prepare to serve you hold the ball in your palm touching the right side of it with your blade with a slight pull back and forward as a ready for a tomahawk. You then do your usual sidespin pendulum. As soon as you have finished it you do the end motion of the tomohawk.
I try to do the diametrically opposite pre and post fake. So If am going to topspin the serve I make out that I have backspun.
Now they may catch on to this bluff. So then I make it much more subtle.
I try to bluff pre and post pendulum sidespin backspin but do pendulum sidespin topspin.
There are some other curious things you can do. One I thought of that looks ridiculous but totally worth trying is:
When you do your serve, you bounce your arm each time the ball touches the table.
Anyway I should go practise now and stop talking about this. Hope it helps mate.
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Leshxa
Gold Member Joined: 01/03/2009 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1917 |
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Look for a Killerspin Video on you tube that has some excercises for feel of the paddle. If you start doing these excercises more frequently, it will help your services.
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Back to table tennis...
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Rich215
Premier Member Joined: 02/28/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3488 |
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boz excellent post on serves.....your right...PRACTICE PRACTICE PRACTICE !
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ErikaT
Silver Member Joined: 06/27/2007 Location: Hong Kong Status: Offline Points: 656 |
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if u are doing side spin. u can make full use of the wrist.
i mean doing a full turn on the wrist. even when the blade had touched the ball. u continue to do the full turn. then u will produce a maximum spin
hope u understand, as i cant use english to explain in a clear manner
thx
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Swiff
Platinum Member Joined: 06/09/2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2587 |
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Practice. (Remember to brush, not hit the ball. Faster the brush and more extreme the racket angle. The more spin)
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cagaragesales
Platinum Member Joined: 10/03/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2023 |
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Ohhgourami got it right. Played him a few days ago at Walnut Gym. I'd say his strongest shot is his serves. He's got it down, just needs a bit more variation. Good short under and short side serves though.
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dragon kid
Premier Member Joined: 07/28/2007 Status: Offline Points: 2947 |
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get the maximum movement from your wrist (find the best way to hold the paddle to enable you to do this).. timing is important.. don't hold the bat too tight on serves.. experiment on where to contact the ball to get maximum spin.. nearer the tip is usually best to get maximum spin because that is where the bat travel the fastest.. the best server I ever see contact the ball near the tip of the bat on most of his serves.. |
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'Nobody is Perfect. I am Nobody' |
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dragon kid
Premier Member Joined: 07/28/2007 Status: Offline Points: 2947 |
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also the higher your toss the better the spin, but the harder to get the timing right..
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'Nobody is Perfect. I am Nobody' |
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Recanter
Super Member Joined: 10/30/2005 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 161 |
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Trying to make it simple as possible.
If you are serving long and deep with little spin, you are probably hitting the ball in the middle of your bat. 1. For starters, just try to contact the ball at the edge of your bat. 2. Once you have this mastered, you can increase the spin by using your wrist to make a last second brush to the ball. 3. Once you have this mastered, you add timing to your contact. This is where your ball toss comes into play. You must have a consistent ball toss to have a high quality serve. This way you know exactly "where and when" the ball will drop so you can be in position and time your brush perfectly. Lots of players stumble on learning serve because they throw the ball a different way every time. Perfect practice makes perfect. Enjoy :) |
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Timo Boll ALC ST
FH: BTY Tenergy 64 2.1 BH: BTY EJ Max |
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5370H55V
Beginner Joined: 10/27/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 79 |
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Thanks for the replies so far. Like many of you said, I've been hitting the ball near the back instead of bottom, with the center instead of the edge of the bat. I haven't realized this until you guys pointed it out! And for the record I'm using the 729 V6 with cream transcend rubber.
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bozbrisvegas
Premier Member Joined: 09/27/2008 Location: Behind you Status: Offline Points: 3728 |
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Your rubber seems quite alright to be able to produce a lot of spin - I checked the specs which i think are 50/50 speed and spin so basically you need to practise. copy copy copy players around you that can do what you are trying to do.
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ThaiLe
Platinum Member Joined: 04/18/2008 Location: Bay Area Status: Offline Points: 2186 |
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Excellent points... |
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DanBrizVegas
Member Joined: 03/26/2009 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 39 |
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Boz makes good points.
I tried them against him last night, and for once in a blue moon i actually was effective in serving... the biggest thing From what i gather is backspin. going underneat the ball instead of behind it - even with the most gentle motion - really stops you "pushing" the ball into the table, so to speak.
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roundrobin
Premier Member Joined: 10/02/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 4708 |
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So how do I improve spin in my services? Right now most of my serves are fast and deep, with a little back/side spin. They are being easily blocked or looped no matter where I place it. One guy I play with can serve almost as fast as me, but with tons more spin in it. So what's the trick in getting fast spinny serves?
Right now your wrist is probably too stiff when you try to serve. You should concentrate on loosen up your wrist as much as possible when you serve. Get an anti-spin rubber like Butterfly Super Anti or any other cheap anti and try to practice serve with it. Practice serving with as much spin as possible with the anti for at least 10 minutes a day, followed by another 15 minutes session with your normal rubber.
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stiltt
Assistant Admin Joined: 07/15/2007 Location: Location Status: Offline Points: 984 |
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www.boudour.com/servepractice it works
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bozbrisvegas
Premier Member Joined: 09/27/2008 Location: Behind you Status: Offline Points: 3728 |
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Dan,
You clown! Love the name, DanBrizvegas lol we sound like brothers...
And finally welcome to posting instead of lurking around.
I'm really happy finally that there is someone on this forum I can say I know.
p.s. thanks for the beers and pong last night.
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larrytt
Silver Member Joined: 04/04/2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 971 |
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More than any other technique in table tennis, you need a coach if you
want to develop spinny serves. Once you learn the basic technique, then
you can take it from there. Make sure to get spinny inverted rubber if
you want to maximize the spin, and really put your wrist into each
serve. (Keep it loose and relaxed.) One suggestion - when you are first
learning to put spin on the ball with your serve, try it away from the
table, on a rug. That way you can concentrate on technique and spin,
and the rug gives pretty good feedback if you are getting spin. When
you can create great spin, then try controlling it at the table with a
regular serve. Good luck!
-Larry Hodges www.larrytt.com |
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729 FX
Silver Member Joined: 03/16/2009 Location: Malaysia Status: Offline Points: 619 |
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Agree with Recanter's comment. A serve contact at the edge of the bat produces more spin as it brushes the ball as compared with the contact at the middle of the bat.
Also your equipment is OK for spinnier serves.
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