|
|
Grip issues. Epiphany! |
Post Reply | Page <12 |
Author | ||
ohhgourami
Platinum Member Joined: 08/12/2008 Location: SoCal Status: Offline Points: 2341 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
If you refer to hinge as in swinging door motion of the wrist, then what you guys are saying makes a bit more sense. Hinge movement should never be used to produce power. You can hinge and unhinge to change the angle of the shot to add sidespin, but your wrist is not a fulcrum. Wrist should almost always be used as minor adjustment for angles and pressure on the ball.
There's way too much terminology getting thrown around here. I want to make sure we are on the same page. How upright you hold the blade has nothing to do with fh or bh oriented gripping. This is way too complicated to explain with words; I much much rather show you with webchat or something instead... |
||
Custom Walnut 7-ply
DHS H3 Provincial untuned 40° BTY T64 210g |
||
Sponsored Links | ||
tpgh2k
Platinum Member Joined: 09/14/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2103 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
what he said =D
|
||
www.youtube.com/gsutabletennis
Timo Boll Spirit FL H3 Blue Sponge Black FH Tenergy 64 Red BH |
||
ohhgourami
Platinum Member Joined: 08/12/2008 Location: SoCal Status: Offline Points: 2341 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
Tuan, where is this 4th day tinarc vid?
I think all your points are correct except for maybe upright grip. It is quite upright, but I think it should be the least of his worries as his major mechanics are the real flaws. Got facebook icontek? |
||
Custom Walnut 7-ply
DHS H3 Provincial untuned 40° BTY T64 210g |
||
tpgh2k
Platinum Member Joined: 09/14/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2103 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
pm'ed it to you since it's a private listing.
|
||
www.youtube.com/gsutabletennis
Timo Boll Spirit FL H3 Blue Sponge Black FH Tenergy 64 Red BH |
||
ohhgourami
Platinum Member Joined: 08/12/2008 Location: SoCal Status: Offline Points: 2341 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
Yup, I can confirm that everything you said was right Tuan.
Icontek, everything that both Tuan and I have comment only applies to your fh. I won't start on your bh yet as the mechanics are obviously very different and you need to fix one thing at a time anyway. I already spent about 3 days completely changing my bh to a pure loop that can be full utilized over the table in matchplay. I can only describe it as very Ma Long-like. |
||
Custom Walnut 7-ply
DHS H3 Provincial untuned 40° BTY T64 210g |
||
richrf
Gold Member Joined: 06/02/2009 Location: Stamford Status: Offline Points: 1522 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
There are definitely different ways to impart spin and speed. What I rely on is speed and touch which comes from the relaxed grip as well as a relaxed body. You can see in this video how relaxed and low Waldner holds his racket as well as the unique racket arc that follows: Noticed the very relaxed wrist. It takes time to develop but a relaxed body that winds up and unwinds rapidly as a unit (including the arm and wrist) because it is relaxed can impart a tremendous amount of speed and spin. But as Ovtcharov said in a recent interview, it all requires patience, patience, patience. Also, one must have some idea of how to go about developing a relaxed body and technique. This is difficult to teach so it has to be self-learned. In fact, the #1 instruction I give to all my friends who I introduce to the game is never tense up. Always keep very relaxed. It really helps them feel the ball and develop a very nice rhythm. For example, recovery is very natural because the whole body naturally drops into a ready position. |
||
ohhgourami
Platinum Member Joined: 08/12/2008 Location: SoCal Status: Offline Points: 2341 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
WLQ is pretty relaxed when he hits fh. Don't know how you think he is tense. The only time he does tense is right at contact which Waldner also does. Maybe it is less apparent as Waldner isn't stand 6ft behind the table with non-speed glue and 40mm ball.
|
||
Custom Walnut 7-ply
DHS H3 Provincial untuned 40° BTY T64 210g |
||
richrf
Gold Member Joined: 06/02/2009 Location: Stamford Status: Offline Points: 1522 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
Yes, I agree with you. I apologize for my wording. What I was attempting to say is that the two techniques (WLQ and Waldner) are very similar. One can do amazing things with the racket if the body is relaxed and, as you say, tenses up just at the moment of impact. The amount the player may tense up depends upon the shot. I love wacking at the ball with my backhand as my body unwinds smack into the ball and deliver the speed and force by exploding my wrist at the moment of impact. It is a great feeling. :-) It is exactly the same as martial arts technique. The only difference is that the ball instead of the human is the receiver of the force. This is more appropriate for my personality. :-)
|
||
tpgh2k
Platinum Member Joined: 09/14/2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2103 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
the beginning of your swing will always be relaxed. the most important part that i'm being reminded constantly on is that the swing should be a sudden acceleration, not a constant speed swing (chops yells at me for it [cry])
that sort of swing will help with "impact".
|
||
www.youtube.com/gsutabletennis
Timo Boll Spirit FL H3 Blue Sponge Black FH Tenergy 64 Red BH |
||
blahness
Premier Member Joined: 10/18/2009 Location: Melbourne Status: Offline Points: 5443 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
|
||
-------
Viscaria FH: Hurricane 8-80 BH: D05 Back to normal shape bats :( |
||
jinlai
Super Member Joined: 12/21/2011 Location: Malaysia Status: Offline Points: 240 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
Hi everybody,
Would appreciate if someone could post images of the top 10 shakehand players on how they grip their blades showing both the front and back of their hands/blades (I am not interested in the brands/models). I am sure this will be of great help to all players who are new to this game. |
||
dingyibvs
Gold Member Joined: 05/09/2011 Location: California Status: Offline Points: 1401 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
I don't know what martial arts you guys have been practicing, but with my style of fighting, when I start swinging the ball(s) is(are) always a possible target
|
||
Blade: Hurricane Long 5 (968) FL
FH: D09C max BH: D09C max |
||
Imago
Premier Member Joined: 07/19/2009 Location: Sofia Status: Offline Points: 5897 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
Snake or monkey style will do the job.
|
||
viktorovich
Super Member Joined: 04/08/2009 Status: Offline Points: 294 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
More precisely : that point of a trajectory , in which will be a ball at the moment of contact with a racket.
|
||
richrf
Gold Member Joined: 06/02/2009 Location: Stamford Status: Offline Points: 1522 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
I think if you watch the videos you will find that many (maybe all) of the top players are constantly adjusting their grips depending upon the type of shot (serve, push, drive, sidespin, loop, etc.). The racket is held very loosely in their hands and they are constantly adjusting.
|
||
jinlai
Super Member Joined: 12/21/2011 Location: Malaysia Status: Offline Points: 240 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
Thank you, richrf. I noticed most European players are using the shallow grip and most Chinese players are using the deep grip, am I right?
|
||
richrf
Gold Member Joined: 06/02/2009 Location: Stamford Status: Offline Points: 1522 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
Hi, I will try to explain in words what most of the top players are doing, especially the Chinese since the Chinese I believe have a very different understanding of the game than you might find in other countries. The top players are not choking up on the handle. they are resting their hands very comfortably on the handle. The V between the index finger and thumb are not choking up on the head of the racket. It is resting lower so that the head position can be easily rotated if necessary. Everything is relaxed. Not spaghetti relaxed however. As a shot is prepared, the racket is adjusted. You will often see this happening when players switch from backhand to forehand but even forehand and backhand positioning changes depending upon the desired angle of contact, type of spin, height of ball, type of contact (brushing or direct), etc. If a player is choking up and holding the racket tight, these type of quick adjustments are very difficult if not impossible. You can observe Wang Liqin, Waldner, Samsonov, Ma Long, etc. during slow motion videos and you will get the idea. Many players decide to choke up on the blade and hold it tighter because it gives them a more direct feeling of the ball when they hit it. However, learning you to hold the racket in a more relaxed manner and only pressing thumb and index finger on contact, allows greater fluiding, greater racket speed, ability to use the wrist, as well as more options. This is not something that you can willfully learn. The only thing you can really think about is staying relaxed and over time building body memory and body intelligence. Then allow the natural body intelligence to choose the shot and position of the racket. It is like a basketball player who over time naturally learns how to shoot that ball into the basket. It is not something that is measured and calculated. The body develops an intelligence that does it automatically. But you will notice that all top players in all sports are usually very relaxed. Hope this helps.
|
||
bluebucket
Platinum Member Joined: 02/20/2011 Location: 16 Status: Offline Points: 2882 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
A forehand orientated grip has the grip rotated forward in your hand so that the highest pressure points of the handle in your hand are edge to edge rather than all the flat surfaces of the handle on the flat surfaces of your hand. Backhand is the other way around so that the blade has more angle on backhand strokes and less angle on the forehand. The stronger the player you are the more angle you can play so it obvious that you will play with more angle on your strongest side (or adjust your grip between strokes to play large angles from both sides)
|
||
richrf
Gold Member Joined: 06/02/2009 Location: Stamford Status: Offline Points: 1522 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
Here is a great video featuring Oh Sang Uhn (a great person to model a game after) illustrating the nature of a relaxed grip and how it can be usefully deployed to execute forehand and backhand flicks:
Edited by richrf - 01/22/2012 at 10:08pm |
||
zrrbiteDK
Silver Member Joined: 06/16/2008 Location: Denmark Status: Offline Points: 587 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
Cool! I enjoyed that. Oh Sang is one of the most relaxed players and has some of the best flicks in the world. Edited by zrrbiteDK - 01/23/2012 at 11:32am |
||
Current:
Avalox BT777 / ? / ? |
||
richrf
Gold Member Joined: 06/02/2009 Location: Stamford Status: Offline Points: 1522 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
|
Glad you enjoyed it. I keep reviewing the video to capture the image in my mind. He is very relaxed and uses his whole body in a very subtle way to coax the ball over.
Edited by richrf - 01/23/2012 at 11:38am |
||
Post Reply | Page <12 |
Tweet
|
Forum Jump | Forum Permissions You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot create polls in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum |
Forum Home | Go to the Forums | Forum Help | Disclaimer
MyTableTennis.NET is the trading name of Alex Table Tennis Ltd. |