as learning how to use it,

Anti is easier to learn and master with shorter period of time, it varies in brand as well, but comparing with long pip, the flat surface can be easier to learn how to control the shots, where as long pip will bend their pips causing as much confusion for yourself.

 

Moreover, long pip varies between brand (friendship 755 versus Feint Long 2) and would need considerable much longer time to master

 

Anti

- Hitting is good and controllable except it's tend to be slower than long pip as Anti usuauly come with dead sponge.

- Blocking is better than long pip as Anti kills off the spin & speed much easier with similar reason stated above

- Chopping can be done as well as the long pip without much problem

- Serving with Anti is more effective as opponent doesn't always realize it's from Anti-spin (very useful with combination of normal inverted)

- Reversal/Deception are good, but generally not as good as long pip, but in return, your control is much easier

 

 

Long pips,

- Hitting comes out faster most of the time and hard to lift, hitting for long pip is better with lower degree in control

- Blocking is generally not as well as Anti, could be hard to do. however it could be done easier with OX

- Chopping is no issue, skill dependent

- Serving isn't always a good choice for one who is well understood on long pip characteristic, and hard to confused as it's more obvious when opponent can see it most of the time.

- Reversal/Deception is better as it's very easy to add spin toward incoming balls. It could generate a decend push for some long pip, thus more deception if you can use long pip well

That would depend on the type of anti. I agree if you are talking about a classic anti like BTY Super Anti or Yasaka Anti Power. It is not true for completely slick antis such as the Dr. Neubauer (like ABS) or Der Materialspezialist (like Beast) antis. For those you would need at least 6 month to get to the same level as before switching as the are much more difficult to control and it is a completely different game compared to classic anti.

Matt; why do you choose to play with anti instead of LPs?

+1. Antis have mostly fallen out of favor in favor of LPs. I've been using LPs, but I like the idea of both surfaces being smooth, which makes it harder for the opponent to recognize which side is being used; however, every time I try to make the switch to anti I get frustrated and give up before I figure out how to use it. I have a sheet of Dr. Neubauer Gorilla sitting here in a package. Hmmmm.

Matt, please let me be an echo . . . why do you choose to play with anti instead of LPs?

:-).

 

Another advantage of anti is return of serve. I think it's easier than long pips to return difficult serves.

The slick Dr. N or Der Materialspezialist antis give you extreme spin reversal like the now banned frictionless LPs (like Dr. N Superblock) used to give you. So if you do a passive block on a topspin loop the ball comes back with extreme underspin; some people say the reversal with a slick anti is even better than with frictionless pips. If you aggressivle push against underspin the ball comes back with topspin and gets a really cool kick off the bounce. So the slick anti works very well against players who use a lot of spin (loop, serve, etc.) however against players with no spin (like hardbat or short pip) it becomes very difficult.

If you want to play close to the table (looping with FH) blocking with your backhand at some level it becomes very difficult to block or return the loops with a legal long pip with friction. At a high level the only way to use long pips is to chop away from the table which is not my game. However, with the slick anti to play a disruptive game at the table but they are not good for chopping away from the table.

 

Toprank wrote: Another advantage of anti is return of serve. I think it's easier than long pips to return difficult serves.

Yes, if you get very spinny serve but long no-spin serves are actually quite difficult to return and will obviously come back with no spin which makes them easy to attack.

 

JohnnyChop wrote: would you say anti is a slower version of sp? cause thats kinda what i am getting the impression of!

A classic anti (like BTY Super Anti) might be somewhat similar to a medium pip in that it creates no-spin balls.

First off all, if you want to try a slick anti do NOT start with Gorilla because it is the most difficult one to play with and most who try it cannot tame it. Start out with a slower one like Dr. N ABS or Der Materialspezialist Beat, both in 1.2. You will also have to adjust your strokes compared to what you have been using with the DTecs. Do not chop block with a slick anti but only to a passive block against a loop. Just hold your paddle there (with the right angle) and let the rubber do its magic. Less is more here! The most difficult part of the slick anti is to find the right angles which takes time as it is different from long pips and somewhat counter intuitive. The more topspin the loop got, the MORE you will have to open your blade. Unfortunately, it will take some time to learn how to play slick anti (say 6 month or so) so you cannot just test it like you would do with just another long pip where you know after a couple of sessions if it is good or if it is not going to work for you.

 

tommyzai wrote: Next time you are about to throw out an old sheet of anti (red) please think of me.

I have an old sheet of ABS 1.2 which I am not using anymore and I have a sheet of Grizzly with ABS 1.2 sponge which I only played for 4h. Both in red.

The Grizzly-ABS is a little bit faster than ABS but still with decent control. I would only recommend it for a slower blade though; I thought it was too fast for an Off blade whereas some high level people in Germany for example (like USATT 2300-2500) play the ABS or Beast on fast carbon blades.

Google/Youtube "Simon Huth" and watch his videos! He plays with a Dr. N anti. A couple of years ago he beat Ruwen Filus (#70 in the world now) at a state tournament. Another good anti player (also Dr. N) is "Jens Gester".

I used to do that too for many years but changed my mind more recently.

 

JohnnyChop wrote: thanks Matt thats the first time i heard that slick antis gives more reversal then current LPs!

Yes, indeed you get very heavy reversal like I said similar to banned frictionless LPs (some say even better). But please also keep in mind that current LPs give you very good reversal on chopping (as in: you need to use a very active stroke!) whereas on slick anti you get very heavy reversal on a passive stroke (as in: the less the better!). So it's aimed at a different type of game. I want to defend and chop away from the table you want to use LP, whereas for a disruptive blocking game close to the table the slick anti is more dangerous (some argue that it is also more difficult to control).

 

tommyzai wrote: Is this Simon Huth? http://www.tt-total.tv/regional/suedwest/videos/ansicht/turniere/2009-2010/hessische-meisterschaften-2010/teil-1-der-hessischen-meisterschaften-2010/huth-froehlich-wagenbach-teil-1/ A quote I found: "Huth uses Dr Neubauer Anti Special 1.8mm amd Tenergy 05 2.1mm. He also said he tried the ABS, which is easier to play, but he gets more spin reversal from the Anti Special, and at his level that's what's most important." Edited by tommyzai - 9 minutes ago at 3:38pm THE UNSTOPPABLE EJ MADMAN!  For More Information, Contact: [email protected]

 

Yes, that him! I'd say he is probably around 2500 USATT but as you can see in the video he also twiddles a lot. Try to find the video of Huth beating Filus which is amazing!

I forgot that he actually uses Dr N Anti Special which is better for further away from the table than the ABS. Some players like to use a little thicker sponge as it is a little bit easier to block real hard loops (less tendency for the sponge to bottom out; ABS sponge is actually quite hard by the way and many believe the best sponge for slick anti) but the thinner sponge gives more disruptive effect and plays a little bit more like ox in terms of feel.

Another player to watch might be Amelie Solja from Germany (she plays now internationally for Austria); she is around 60 in the world and uses the Grizzly-ABS which I already mentioned above. Check out her video on how she uses the anti. She only uses 2 stokes: an aggressive push against underspin (resulting in topspin) and a passive block against topspin loop (resulting in heavy underspin). It does not look pretty but it is very effective and it is amazing to see how consistent she plays with the anti.

Also check out the player Maik Schonknecht in this series of videos; I would guess his USATT would be around 2350-2400:

http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLSQiGAk3IbuNmLCfAnCbT5vHxHRXEIp7W" rel="nofollow - http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLSQiGAk3IbuNmLCfAnCbT5vHxHRXEIp7W

 

Just found it:

http://www.tt-news.tv/regional/suedwest/videos/ansicht/turniere/2009-2010/hessische-meisterschaften-2010/teil-7-der-hessischen-meisterschaften/filus-huth-teil-1/" rel="nofollow - http://www.tt-news.tv/regional/suedwest/videos/ansicht/turniere/2009-2010/hessische-meisterschaften-2010/teil-7-der-hessischen-meisterschaften/filus-huth-teil-1/

I am not sure I would treat this as a fact but I guess it depends on the players abilities and the specific style. MP and slick anti are very niche rubbers for sure that only work for a very specific playing style (otherwise a lot more people would use it).

I have yet to meet a guy in the US who is familiar with slick anti from Dr. N or Der Materialspezialist; there are a few more people in Germany who use it but it still very exotic there too.

By the way, with slick anti dead balls are the most difficult balls to play but I think they are easier to deal with with regular anti

Also, check out videos of Jens Gester who does not twiddle but has a very good FH attack as well.

No wonder I was amazed!! LOL Still, his game is inspiring. I really need to start twiddling correctly — using my other hand to help spin the blade is probably not a good technique. :-)

Matt Pimple mentioned Dr N ABS anti. Der Materialspecializt also has slick antis.  The people that use these antis claim they have less friction and provide more reversal than many or most LP 0X.

In general the lower the friction the easier it will be to just get the ball back.  The problem is that you won't be able to get the ball back aggressively.  You can't loop.  You need to substitute placement and reducing the opponent's reaction time by hitting off the block.  Better yet, learn to twiddle too.

Go back and read the thread.  There is a lot of good info there.

you re wrong , the legend is deng yaping and she was an attacker , ding yaping is a defensive chinese player playing bundesliga

The German Anti rubbers have sponge that can absorb energy and still be slick.  LPs start to gain friction when they have sponge but then they can absorb fast loops better.

The Grass D tecs has some great reviews in imparting your own spin and chopping as well as the reversing spin/deception of an Anti.

Anti's are great for blocking and punch blocking.  They can kill spin and speed if you leave a ball hanging it will become "slam bait".

I would like to get a setup like what Matt Pimple has someday and compare it to my Firewall Plus paddles with GD Talon 0X on them.  I have not be playing with the LP paddles lately and when I try to use them now I suck because I have lost the soft touch required to block fast loops and keep them on the table.  A dead frictionless anti should be able to make it easier to handle these kinds of shots.

I do agree with those above that say one has more options with LP.  One can bounce the ball back with a sharp block so that the pips don't bend resulting in maximum spin reversal.  It is also possible to bend the pips by striking the ball more tangentially to get more friction.