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1800 to 2000 USATT. Tips on my video

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Topic: 1800 to 2000 USATT. Tips on my video
Posted By: Rahul_TT
Subject: 1800 to 2000 USATT. Tips on my video
Date Posted: 06/03/2013 at 2:52pm
I just broke 1800 USATT. I have been playing 11 years with most of the improvement coming in the last 2 years (gained about 180 rating points in my first year of playing tournaments here in the US). I am a two winged looper with a heavy spin based game. I have a very good blocking game and good serves. Also, I feel I have very good tactics. My weaknesses are movement, dependence on a big strokes meaning low recovery and ball placement.

I want to know what are the typical improvements one needs when going from 1800 to 2000. Also, what are the key differentiating factors between these two levels. 

Here is my video. I am in Red.





Replies:
Posted By: LoopsALot
Date Posted: 06/03/2013 at 3:10pm
Did you notice improvement in your game over the past year? Or could it be your rating finally caught up with your real level to begin with?

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729 6030L $18
DHS TG3 NEO $17
Gambler Outlaw $14
USATT 1640


Posted By: michael4ster
Date Posted: 06/03/2013 at 3:10pm
I like this question, I am 1800 also and would like to move to 2000. What do 2000 rating players have that 1800 players dont?
 
Thanks,


Posted By: slevin
Date Posted: 06/03/2013 at 3:13pm
Originally posted by Rahul_TT Rahul_TT wrote:

I want to know what are the typical improvements one needs when going from 1800 to 2000. Also, what are the key differentiating factors between these two levels. 

To a large extent, compartmentalizing general game quality & progression based on USATT levels is meaningless. If you post your game video here, you'll get lots of quality help.


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Trade feedback:
http://mytabletennis.net/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=50787" rel="nofollow - http://mytabletennis.net/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=50787


Posted By: roundrobin
Date Posted: 06/03/2013 at 3:45pm
Short answer:  Improve your BH, unless you are still a junior and can move around the table extremely fast to cover 70% of the table with your fh. 

Most adult 1800 level players have told me they definitely have "2000-level" forehand loops, but when I looked at them their fh loops are only "2000-level" if you feed them perfectly placed pushes and blocks, so they don't have to move much as their lateral movement is too slow for their level.  Also, their BH is usually nowhere near 2000-level, more like 1600 as compared to kids who are receiving top-notch coaching.  These amateur adult players can learn tons by watching Eugene Wang and Karakasevic's bh. 

The truth is for most adults and amateurs in general, BH should be the foundation for their game, but most coaches here in the U.S. still treat these players as promising cadets/juniors and drill their fh to death.  Trust me, if you want a long and prosperous TT career at the amateur level you should spend most of your free time learning your BH.




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Current USATT Rating: 2181
Argentina National Team Member, 1985-1986.
Current Club: Los Angeles Table Tennis Association.
My Setup: Yinhe Q1 / T64 2.1 black / Saviga V 0.5mm red



Posted By: Rahul_TT
Date Posted: 06/03/2013 at 3:52pm
Originally posted by slevin slevin wrote:

Originally posted by Rahul_TT Rahul_TT wrote:

I want to know what are the typical improvements one needs when going from 1800 to 2000. Also, what are the key differentiating factors between these two levels. 

To a large extent, compartmentalizing general game quality & progression based on USATT levels is meaningless. If you post your game video here, you'll get lots of quality help.

Added!


Posted By: Rahul_TT
Date Posted: 06/03/2013 at 3:56pm
Originally posted by LoopsALot LoopsALot wrote:

Did you notice improvement in your game over the past year? Or could it be your rating finally caught up with your real level to begin with?

A lot of improvement especially my fh and bh attack. Also short pushes. Mainly fh looping and bh looping are better now. I dont think its a case of rating catching up to my level at all because even my league ratings follow same pattern


Posted By: assiduous
Date Posted: 06/03/2013 at 4:45pm
the blue guy is really low rated. Cannot see ability to sustain attack. I have great opening loop but if you block it a couple of times almost certainly you win the point. My game is similar to yours and what I find I lack compared to a 2000 is ability to sustain rallies. The 2000 players don't die if you block them twice, and very often they can survive a poor serve receive with quality defense. I have very poor defense, and can't see yours from the video, cos the blue dude never managed to pass a loop over the net, but in general the 2000s make u earn every point. Very few unforced errors. U had a lot of misfires on the FH.

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puppy412 : Sorry man, I don't mean to sound disrespectful, but I know that more training will make me better, I don't need to come here to figure that out


Posted By: chronos
Date Posted: 06/03/2013 at 6:33pm
Nice vids!  Rahul I don't know if its just the matches you posted, but you seem really planted on your feet / stationary in the points I saw.  How's your footwork?


Posted By: decoi
Date Posted: 06/03/2013 at 7:24pm
more consistency, being able to anticipate the ball better.. and things such as movement seems a bit sluggish for someone of your build and like chronos said very planted. you need to try keep moving i guess

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Blade: DHS Hurricane Hao
FH: TG3 BS
BH: Xiom Omega 4 Aisa

Blade: Hurricane Hao 2 (656)
Fh: Dhs Gold Arc 3
Bh: Stiga Tour H
http://www.youtube.com/user/decoyla?feature=mhee


Posted By: ashishsharmaait
Date Posted: 06/03/2013 at 9:20pm
You don;t recover as fast as you should be and your linkage between FH loop and BH counter/loop should be better.
After hitting a good FH loop you should be able to recover and sustain at least a couple of more hits from either the BH or the FH.

Could you post a video where you play a higher rated player (2000-2200)? That would hep us scrutinize your defense and the quality of your loops (BH loops/opens in particular).


Posted By: NextLevel
Date Posted: 06/03/2013 at 9:44pm
Rahul_TT, you are self aware enough that you won't get any radical insights on your game. The quality of opposition does not do you justice. I think that one thing you should be looking for is a high level special weapon that your opponents run away from. You might have one, but your opponent was too weak to make you reveal it.

Practice generating power from the elbow and the wrist.  Shorten your motion on service return and see how that translates to the rest of your game.  You should be able to attack the serves you received with a smaller stroke on the forehand side.


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https://youtu.be/jhO4K_yFhh8?t=115" rel="nofollow - I like putting heavy topspin on the ball...
Cybershape Carbon
FH/BH: H3P 41D.
Lumberjack TT, not for lovers of beautiful strokes. No time to train...


Posted By: silva7
Date Posted: 06/03/2013 at 10:34pm
i did not really see the other guy attack and when he did, you were not really prepared to block. how do you play when your opponent initiates the attack? your serves are mainly half long so for a decent player, it would be easy to loop, footwork is definitely a problem. 

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RSM Special Platinum T64


Posted By: jasonz
Date Posted: 06/03/2013 at 10:54pm
Rahul, Thanks for the post.  Here are a couple of suggestions
1) Watch the serve, on short serves move in, on long serves attack (may need to take a step back to get full swing)
2) Your loops are too predictable translated to too easy to block.  You need to attack middle more or spread to your opponents weaker wing.
3) Bend your legs and stay on the ball of your feet.  This will add response time for you.  
4) Continue to use videos and critique.

Good luck, Jason


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Jason Z

Stiga Xu Xin Dynasty
FH DHS TG -60 Soft
BH DHS H3 white sponge pro


Posted By: DDreamer
Date Posted: 06/03/2013 at 11:52pm
Originally posted by roundrobin roundrobin wrote:

...but when I looked at them their fh loops are only "2000-level" if you feed them perfectly placed pushes and blocks...
+1
 
Your loops aren't too bad but you preparation is very poor and when you do make the intial preparations you don't make the necessary subtle adjustments. Look at the second point of the first game (at 0.21) you serve and the remain upright ready to to a push off a long ball. You must serve and get ready to attack off every serve, not just every now and then. If the ball falls short then abort to a push or flick. Also, when you do prepare to attack the next ball it is never going to be in the right spot for you so you must adjust to the individual requirements of THAT ball. Every ball is different - you can't just have a one-swing-fits-all approach.  look at 1.06, 3.46, 4.25.

Other areas:

- you are very flat-flooted. keep your heels off the ground - even when doing the most basic exercises
- you invariably approach a serve to push it. Always approach a serve to loop it. If it goes short then it is easy to abort to a push or flick. 
- you should do lots and lots and lots of footwork practice. On an related issues, also practice transitioning from one shot to the next.
- you make way too many unforced errors and your shot selection is dodgy (this is related to the lack of preparation/adjustment discussed above)  

Sorry to be negative but the theme of the thread to is point out areas which need work so that you reach 2000. Basically I think you need to start doing some tough drilling.  




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I know that faster equipment will make me better, I don't need to come here to figure that out


Posted By: blahness
Date Posted: 06/04/2013 at 11:37am
I think the blue guy is too low ranked for a player of your standard, you should be aiming to keep him from winning even 5 points for each game. 

Things i noticed:

1) Posture: I think you need to bend your knees slightly more (you're not that tall and therefore you don't need to bend your knees that much, but still, a little bend does wonders for your footwork and it enables you to feel your legs pushing off the ground with your loop)

2) Footwork. You don't recover from the serve immediately, you just kinda stand there upright and watch the ball (probably because the other player is not giving you enough trouble?). It should be a smooth 1-2 movement. Try using less arm and more waist when you're serving, it definitely helps a lot with the spin, control as well as recovery (when you move your waist you create a turning momentum which helps you get into position faster). 

3) You stand a bit too close to the table, I think a player with good quality long pushes would jam you quite badly. Try moving your right leg further back when receiving serves and move in more when you receive short serves.

4) In terms of your FH/BH strokes, you are still using too much arm backswing, you need to shorten it even more and use your waist/legs to directly guide your backswing. More body support behind each single loop would help you a lot in terms of power and consistency. In particular, I think your legwork is still not there yet. 

I like how you actually make an effort to apply heavy spin on the ball when pushing, keep it up! Your serves also look quite deceptive and tight, which is a really good thing. 


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-------
Viscaria
FH: Hurricane 8-80
BH: D05

Back to normal shape bats :(


Posted By: gatorling
Date Posted: 06/04/2013 at 3:53pm
I really hate to agree with round robin on this..but it's the truth.
FH will get you winners, BH will keep you alive.
A very strong FH and a weak BH means you must have incredible fitness and excellent footwork as well as impeccable FH technique.

If however, your FH is "good" and your BH is excellent then you will have an overall stronger game.

I have a good FH and used to have a horrendous BH, now my BH is decent and because of that I've jumped 150 points. People used to always push deep to my BH or attack it and I'd always end up blocking..which would lead to a rally that I'd eventually lose. Now that I take the initiative, they are much more cautious about placing it to my BH..It really gives me many more opportunities.

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Forehand: Hurricane 3 Provincial #20 sponge
Backhand: Rakza 7 Max
Blade:    Xiom Aria


Posted By: cole_ely
Date Posted: 06/05/2013 at 8:35pm
Here's a simple thing that should help.  You need to work on your pushes.  It looks like you're trying to jab at or punch the pushes.  Simplify the stroke, shorten the take back.  Keep the stroke parallel to the table instead of pushing up or down.  Part of it is pushing longer balls that should be spun.  At 1800 you're better than me, but I see more quick room for improvement in short game than I do in improving your loop or even loop preparation.

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Wavestone St with Illumina 1.9r, defender1.7b

Please let me know if I can be of assistance.


Posted By: yogi_bear
Date Posted: 06/05/2013 at 8:57pm
improve your contact of the ball on your pushes and also i'm seeing you tend to jump when you attack. having your feet mid-air while contacting the ball lessens your power on the shots

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Independent online TT Product reviewer of XIOM, STIGA, JOOLA, SANWEI, GEWO, AIR, ITC, APEX, YASAKA and ABROS

ITTF Level 1 Coaching Course Conductor, ITTF Level 1 Coach


Posted By: snerdly
Date Posted: 06/05/2013 at 11:35pm
Many great tips have been provided here; be on the balls of your feet, not planted for your shots. Improve your BH.  Pushes should be parallel with the table.  You should tighten up your serves, though they are good; but especially tighten up your receives, you should rarely miss against a player of the level you were playing in this vid. Commit to the return of service seriously, it is a very important part of the game.
Make footwork the most important part of your looping game at this point, both FH and BH.  Your first loop is good, but you must be prepared to continue the attack to make good progress.

When my game was at about the same state as yours I began to use less power on loops and sought to use consistency, variation and placement, with an aim to play more loops in the rally in order to learn to play out points more strategically, and learn how to rally to win in longer points.
This can be a bit frustrating at first until you learn to follow the play and move well to the ball.  The benefits of this approach however, are tremendous.

Good luck!


Posted By: dingyibvs
Date Posted: 06/06/2013 at 12:35am
BH is by far your biggest weakness.  Footwork can wait, improving that will just cause you to use your FH even more.  Trust me, having essentially zero capability to attack backspins to the BH side simply won't cut it against 2000+ level players.  After improving your BH, footwork would be next in line.

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Blade: Hurricane Long 5 (968) FL
FH: D09C max
BH: D09C max


Posted By: snerdly
Date Posted: 06/06/2013 at 2:19am
Originally posted by dingyibvs dingyibvs wrote:

Footwork can wait, improving that will just cause you to use your FH even more.  

I agree that the BH opening is a big concern here, but by stating,

"Make footwork the most important part of your looping game at this point, both FH and BH."

I did not intend that Rahul_TT should attempt to use his FH more, quite the contrary, but that he should attempt to get in better position for his loops, as stated, for both FH and BH.  Even the BH opening against under spin requires acquiring proper footwork to get into position.  Focusing on improving positioning will help break the habit of being planted and unable to move smoothly for the next ball, forcing loops, and being predictable in his looping.



Posted By: blahness
Date Posted: 06/06/2013 at 8:26am
Originally posted by cole_ely cole_ely wrote:

Here's a simple thing that should help.  You need to work on your pushes.  It looks like you're trying to jab at or punch the pushes.  Simplify the stroke, shorten the take back.  Keep the stroke parallel to the table instead of pushing up or down.  Part of it is pushing longer balls that should be spun.  At 1800 you're better than me, but I see more quick room for improvement in short game than I do in improving your loop or even loop preparation.

If you watch ZJK, Ma Lin or Ryu Seung Min push, they seem like they're "jabbing" the ball with the bat pointing forwards, and for me that sort of technique allows me to reach shorter balls, and seem to generate more spin.


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-------
Viscaria
FH: Hurricane 8-80
BH: D05

Back to normal shape bats :(


Posted By: bonggoy
Date Posted: 06/06/2013 at 2:07pm
Originally posted by dingyibvs dingyibvs wrote:

BH is by far your biggest weakness.  Footwork can wait, improving that will just cause you to use your FH even more.  Trust me, having essentially zero capability to attack backspins to the BH side simply won't cut it against 2000+ level players.  After improving your BH, footwork would be next in line.


I have to disagree with this. It is very hard to execute a proper loop (actually any stroke) without getting in the correct position. I've seen people with powerful FH and BH loops during regular drills that were reduced to pushing and blocking. They are unable to properly get into position because of poor footwork.



Posted By: roundrobin
Date Posted: 06/06/2013 at 2:56pm
Originally posted by bonggoy bonggoy wrote:

Originally posted by dingyibvs dingyibvs wrote:

BH is by far your biggest weakness.  Footwork can wait, improving that will just cause you to use your FH even more.  Trust me, having essentially zero capability to attack backspins to the BH side simply won't cut it against 2000+ level players.  After improving your BH, footwork would be next in line.


I have to disagree with this. It is very hard to execute a proper loop (actually any stroke) without getting in the correct position. I've seen people with powerful FH and BH loops during regular drills that were reduced to pushing and blocking. They are unable to properly get into position because of poor footwork.



You can cover lots of ground with a bh stance by primarily using your arm, upper body and waist rotation, with very little footwork.  Many Paralympic TT players do this, and some of them are rated as high as 2500.  I am not saying footwork is not important, but there are ways to go around poor footwork to still improve your level in a significant way.
Many standing disabled players simply use their lower body as a stable platform that glides around smoothly with minimum footwork... There's a lot to learn from these players for average Joe's who read this forum, imho, in addition to study and mimic what Ma Long and ZJK do.





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Current USATT Rating: 2181
Argentina National Team Member, 1985-1986.
Current Club: Los Angeles Table Tennis Association.
My Setup: Yinhe Q1 / T64 2.1 black / Saviga V 0.5mm red



Posted By: Rahul_TT
Date Posted: 06/06/2013 at 2:59pm
I see the point. I also feel that when I have a good BH, I can set up more plays. Also, it reduces the dependency on my already weak movement. No point denying the importance of footwork but for a vertically limited player like me, a strong BH would mean less shots that are hit on my wide open forehand..
So I think to some extent it depends on the make-up of a player also.


Posted By: Makelele
Date Posted: 06/06/2013 at 3:31pm
So this deserves another useful thread, namely, how to develop a great backhand?Smile


Posted By: ckhirnigs113
Date Posted: 06/06/2013 at 3:35pm
Rahul_TT, I think we played each other last year in Decatur, AL if I remember correctly. From our match, I think footwork may have been your biggest problem. I remember you having pretty good loops, but I was able to get enough of them back that you eventually made a mistake. I think footwork was to blame. Even though your looping stroke is good, you will never be able to be consistent without getting your feet in the right position for every shot.  

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Blade: Victas Koji Matsushita FL
FH: Xiom Vega Japan MAX
BH: TSP P-1R 1.0mm
USATT Rating: 1947


Posted By: Rahul_TT
Date Posted: 06/06/2013 at 3:44pm
Originally posted by ckhirnigs113 ckhirnigs113 wrote:

Rahul_TT, I think we played each other last year in Decatur, AL if I remember correctly. From our match, I think footwork may have been your biggest problem. I remember you having pretty good loops, but I was able to get enough of them back that you eventually made a mistake. I think footwork was to blame. Even though your looping stroke is good, you will never be able to be consistent without getting your feet in the right position for every shot.  

Hi Chris. Yes I remember that match. Thanks for your feedback.. I am beginning to blame my footwork for missing my forehands a lot. I have tried to work extensively on foot balance, weight transfer and body rotation but I see that if I am not in the right position, I am missing the shot.
Coming from someone I actually played, this is valuable. As is everything else in this thread. 




Posted By: Makelele
Date Posted: 06/06/2013 at 4:43pm
Rahul, when I am about to receive a serve, I try to get on  Ithe balls of my feet with my upper body more forwards and I move my feet a bit. All this work for me as a reminder that I don't have to stay "heavy" on the floor and  that I must be ready to move my legs if I want to make a good stroke a very good one and a bad stroke a good one. Hope this helps.


Posted By: snerdly
Date Posted: 06/06/2013 at 10:42pm
Originally posted by roundrobin roundrobin wrote:



You can cover lots of ground with a bh stance by primarily using your arm, upper body and waist rotation, with very little footwork.  Many Paralympic TT players do this, and some of them are rated as high as 2500.  I am not saying footwork is not important, but there are ways to go around poor footwork to still improve your level in a significant way.
Many standing disabled players simply use their lower body as a stable platform that glides around smoothly with minimum footwork... There's a lot to learn from these players for average Joe's who read this forum, imho, in addition to study and mimic what Ma Long and ZJK do.

If I understand correctly, this is a better way to state what I intended; get into better position for your loops.  The amount of footwork needed can be significantly diminished by having a competent BH opening, along with of course, adequate BH rallying capabilities teamed with solid FH/BH transition skills.


Posted By: dingyibvs
Date Posted: 06/07/2013 at 2:02am
Originally posted by bonggoy bonggoy wrote:

Originally posted by dingyibvs dingyibvs wrote:

BH is by far your biggest weakness.  Footwork can wait, improving that will just cause you to use your FH even more.  Trust me, having essentially zero capability to attack backspins to the BH side simply won't cut it against 2000+ level players.  After improving your BH, footwork would be next in line.


I have to disagree with this. It is very hard to execute a proper loop (actually any stroke) without getting in the correct position. I've seen people with powerful FH and BH loops during regular drills that were reduced to pushing and blocking. They are unable to properly get into position because of poor footwork.


Yeah, but you know what else prevents someone from executing loops during games?  If you can't even execute them while standing still doing drills.  One step at a time my man, one step at a time.


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Blade: Hurricane Long 5 (968) FL
FH: D09C max
BH: D09C max


Posted By: Leshxa
Date Posted: 07/07/2013 at 7:44pm
I had a pleasure of playing Rahul today and getting beaten by him, so yet again I will say that the video does not show how good some of his skills are. For one, anything in his forehand zone is killed. His backhand is very good too. Push service returns are really good. Although on the video ( and in person ) he does look like he is not moving at all, he is able to reach quite a lot of positions for shots. Perhaps it was his opponent in the video didn't allow him to show his strengths.

All I can say is that he is on his way. His basic set of skills are in good form and I think a few more tweaks with some parts of the game can push him a lot farther. Great job Rahul! Keep up the hard work.


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Back to table tennis...


Posted By: Makelele
Date Posted: 07/07/2013 at 10:01pm
Alex, you are a gentlemanClap


Posted By: Rahul_TT
Date Posted: 07/08/2013 at 10:24am
Originally posted by Leshxa Leshxa wrote:

I had a pleasure of playing Rahul today and getting beaten by him, so yet again I will say that the video does not show how good some of his skills are. For one, anything in his forehand zone is killed. His backhand is very good too. Push service returns are really good. Although on the video ( and in person ) he does look like he is not moving at all, he is able to reach quite a lot of positions for shots. Perhaps it was his opponent in the video didn't allow him to show his strengths.

All I can say is that he is on his way. His basic set of skills are in good form and I think a few more tweaks with some parts of the game can push him a lot farther. Great job Rahul! Keep up the hard work.

Thanks a lot for that Alex!

You forgot to mention that you came off a 12 hour drive straight onto the table, playing a game with minimal warm-up. So I wouldn't read much into the results. It was great playing with you.

Looking forward to some hitting this Tuesday!


Posted By: tt4me
Date Posted: 07/09/2013 at 1:00am
I don't see it.  The first few rallies of the video are pathetic. 
I agree with Nextlevel.  You opponent was barely in the game so you were losing points, your opponent wasn't winning them.  It is all in the video.  There can be no argument. The is no way you are playing at a 1800 level in the video.  It is as if you did the minimum to beat your opponent.

In the first game you only won the last point.  The rest where due to your inept opponent.
It would be better to show a match where you actually have to win some points to win a match.
Except for the last point the first game was a contest to see who could give away points at the slowest rate.

It would have been nice to see the match with leshxa.

OK, so I am a hard ass but I really do think people should only take videos of matches between equally skilled opponents.  The games should be close.  The should be a lot of rallies where someone wins the point instead of loses the point.  There is a difference.  






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Samsonov Alpha+H3 Neo+802 1.5mm, the Ball Whacker is revived!<br />Samsonov Alpha+H3 Neo+802-40 1.8mm my back up<br />BCX5+H3+802-1 1.8mm New but promising.<br />


Posted By: assiduous
Date Posted: 07/09/2013 at 1:58am
i dont care about that. But that exchange between him and lexsha at the end just makes me gag. What kind of straight person talks like that.

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puppy412 : Sorry man, I don't mean to sound disrespectful, but I know that more training will make me better, I don't need to come here to figure that out


Posted By: kickass
Date Posted: 07/09/2013 at 11:10am
I nominate Assiduous for Paranoid of the Week.


Posted By: Rahul_TT
Date Posted: 07/09/2013 at 11:52am
Originally posted by assiduous assiduous wrote:

i dont care about that. But that exchange between him and lexsha at the end just makes me gag. What kind of straight person talks like that.

Says the person whose name starts with "ass".


Posted By: decoi
Date Posted: 07/09/2013 at 12:10pm
as a member of the defense forces i shall permit this fight.

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Blade: DHS Hurricane Hao
FH: TG3 BS
BH: Xiom Omega 4 Aisa

Blade: Hurricane Hao 2 (656)
Fh: Dhs Gold Arc 3
Bh: Stiga Tour H
http://www.youtube.com/user/decoyla?feature=mhee


Posted By: Imago
Date Posted: 07/09/2013 at 12:10pm
Guys, don't be too kind to each other, or girls will leave us...


Posted By: cole_ely
Date Posted: 07/09/2013 at 12:27pm
Originally posted by blahness blahness wrote:


Originally posted by cole_ely cole_ely wrote:

Here's a simple thing that should help.  You need to work on your pushes.  It looks like you're trying to jab at or punch the pushes.  Simplify the stroke, shorten the take back.  Keep the stroke parallel to the table instead of pushing up or down.  Part of it is pushing longer balls that should be spun.  At 1800 you're better than me, but I see more quick room for improvement in short game than I do in improving your loop or even loop preparation.


If you watch ZJK, Ma Lin or Ryu Seung Min push, they seem like they're "jabbing" the ball with the bat pointing forwards, and for me that sort of technique allows me to reach shorter balls, and seem to generate more spin.


They get their racket in place and then take a very short jab which is really a high speed push executed properly but quickly. Often they're reading subtleties of spin and compensating. Anyway you can break the rules once you've mastered them. I'm not saying you can't point the tip forward on short pushes - in fact thats proper. But I bet they're still stroking parallel to the table unless the ball they're pushing is a short topspin.

I'd be interested to get other opinions on this.

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Wavestone St with Illumina 1.9r, defender1.7b

Please let me know if I can be of assistance.


Posted By: kickass
Date Posted: 07/09/2013 at 12:43pm
:)


Posted By: naijachief
Date Posted: 07/09/2013 at 3:53pm
This thread is funny. I play with Rahul from time to time and I must say his game is definitely between 1800-2000 at this time. Yes, I agree that the video posted does not really show his total skill level as his playing partner is not up to his level. Yet, from my personal experience, Rahul is on his way to playing 2000 level as soon as he improves his footwork and his mid distance game. He has good serves, good understanding of spin, nice pace on his forehand and backhand loops and an overall good understanding of the game.

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who no know go know


Posted By: assiduous
Date Posted: 07/09/2013 at 3:58pm
Originally posted by Rahul_TT Rahul_TT wrote:

Originally posted by assiduous assiduous wrote:

i dont care about that. But that exchange between him and lexsha at the end just makes me gag. What kind of straight person talks like that.

Says the person whose name starts with "ass".

You realize that's not a very good serve receive, do you? That's just waiting for a kill, but I don't want to distract the attention from your cuddly exchange.


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Posted By: DDreamer
Date Posted: 07/09/2013 at 7:31pm
Originally posted by naijachief naijachief wrote:

 Yet, from my personal experience, Rahul is on his way to playing 2000 level as soon as he improves his footwork...
I agree with you but, from memory, he has been playing for 11 years. I don't want to sound mean but if he hasn't developed footwork in all that time when is it going to emerge? He actually looks like he has never seriously worked on footwork. I recall seeing a clip of Rahul playing a year or 2 back and he had exactly the same issues. 


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Posted By: naijachief
Date Posted: 07/09/2013 at 11:50pm
Originally posted by DDreamer DDreamer wrote:

Originally posted by naijachief naijachief wrote:

 Yet, from my personal experience, Rahul is on his way to playing 2000 level as soon as he improves his footwork...

I agree with you but, from memory, he has been playing for 11 years. I don't want to sound mean but if he hasn't developed footwork in all that time when is it going to emerge? He actually looks like he has never seriously worked on footwork. I recall seeing a clip of Rahul playing a year or 2 back and he had exactly the same issues. 


Well, in order to correct his footwork problems, I suggest he finds a good practice partner who can assist in good drills. I am not sure where you saw a video of Rahul 2 years ago, but, maybe you can share that info with us. As far as I'm concerned, Rahul played his first USATT tournament in June of last year. His first rating was mid 1600's. His last two tournaments he gained a total of 153 points which puts him at a solid 1800 current rating. So, that also means that he made some improvement to his game recently.

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Posted By: DDreamer
Date Posted: 07/10/2013 at 12:06am
In his original post in this thread Rahul said he has been playing for 11 years but if he has only been playing for a year or so then he has done a very good job. Either way, an increase of 153 points does show improvement. Still, his footwork is an impediment to further improvement and it has to be worked on. 

This is the clip from a year ago.  http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=e5HPpuzFYTM" rel="nofollow - http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=e5HPpuzFYTM




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I know that faster equipment will make me better, I don't need to come here to figure that out


Posted By: bonggoy
Date Posted: 07/10/2013 at 2:18pm
I just watched Rahul's match against Lexsha and rewatch a portion of his previous match.

His footwork is fine. It's not world class level but it's sufficient for his level. He is moving relatively well against his match with Lexsha. He looks like a totally different player to be honest.

The problem I noticed was being lazy about movement. This is evident in his match against Shelton.

He has decent serves but were all long and at the same area (backhand).

He missed a lot of backhand loops to the net.


I would concentrate on this:

- Develop short one or two serves to backhand and forehand.
- Improve your backhand loop against backspin. Rahul - if Lexsha is still there, ask him to show how he does it.

Again, Rahul's footwork is fine for his level. He just need to be less, erm, lazy.




Posted By: Rahul_TT
Date Posted: 07/10/2013 at 2:36pm
Originally posted by DDreamer DDreamer wrote:

Originally posted by naijachief naijachief wrote:

 Yet, from my personal experience, Rahul is on his way to playing 2000 level as soon as he improves his footwork...
I agree with you but, from memory, he has been playing for 11 years. I don't want to sound mean but if he hasn't developed footwork in all that time when is it going to emerge? He actually looks like he has never seriously worked on footwork. I recall seeing a clip of Rahul playing a year or 2 back and he had exactly the same issues. 

I agree that footwork is my biggest concern apart from my backhand loop. I like to keep working on one or two things at one time. My forehand looping is just about to finish and I am happy with my improvements there. Once that is done, I am going to work on BH and movement.

That doesnt mean I haven't been working on it though.

But I want to understand this comment better. I have been playing 11 years and don't have very good footwork. I spent first 9 years in India without a coach playing a lot but with limited learning or exposure to good players. Then, my goals would be to get as much playing time as possible and not levels or ratings.There were days when I would play 13 hours and I made it to my college team of 3 people within 6 months from an initial pool of 30+ just watching videos on the internet and practicing.

Thats why most of my improvement has happened in the last year and half or so and I am happy with that.

But what I learned over those 11 years is invaluable in terms of touch, spin understanding and most of all - tactics. That is why my understanding and tactics are better than a 15 year old 1800 player. So if footwork didn't "emerge", its because it didn't get a chance to. Not because I was lazy.

Anyway, I posted that video not to estimate my level but for feedback because a neutral eye would see more than mine.

I don't think laziness is my problem. Its lack of footwork training which I am working on.


Posted By: Leshxa
Date Posted: 07/10/2013 at 9:59pm
Originally posted by assiduous assiduous wrote:

What kind of straight person talks like that.


Obviously the kind of a straight person you will never be.


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Back to table tennis...


Posted By: Leshxa
Date Posted: 07/10/2013 at 10:06pm
Originally posted by bonggoy bonggoy wrote:

Lexsha is still there, ask him to show how he does it.


I'm far from a role model for footwork, but I'm working hard on trying to improve it. I probably could offer a few pointers that helped me if needed. But I'm still learning...


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Back to table tennis...


Posted By: bonggoy
Date Posted: 07/11/2013 at 11:31am
Originally posted by Leshxa Leshxa wrote:

Originally posted by bonggoy bonggoy wrote:

Lexsha is still there, ask him to show how he does it.


I'm far from a role model for footwork, but I'm working hard on trying to improve it. I probably could offer a few pointers that helped me if needed. But I'm still learning...


Not the footwork. The backhand loop against backspin we all use. The one thought to us by Gerard.


Posted By: decoi
Date Posted: 07/11/2013 at 12:05pm
are we talking about [scouse accent] steve gerard [/scouse accent]




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Blade: DHS Hurricane Hao
FH: TG3 BS
BH: Xiom Omega 4 Aisa

Blade: Hurricane Hao 2 (656)
Fh: Dhs Gold Arc 3
Bh: Stiga Tour H
http://www.youtube.com/user/decoyla?feature=mhee


Posted By: bonggoy
Date Posted: 07/11/2013 at 1:35pm
Originally posted by decoi decoi wrote:

are we talking about [scouse accent] steve gerard [/scouse accent]




Yes.


Posted By: decoi
Date Posted: 07/11/2013 at 1:43pm
just making sure

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Blade: DHS Hurricane Hao
FH: TG3 BS
BH: Xiom Omega 4 Aisa

Blade: Hurricane Hao 2 (656)
Fh: Dhs Gold Arc 3
Bh: Stiga Tour H
http://www.youtube.com/user/decoyla?feature=mhee


Posted By: raphyelrosby
Date Posted: 07/11/2013 at 1:44pm
Is that James Williams in the wheelchair? J-Wall from Atlanta?

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Xiom Hayabusa ZX, Sigma II pro on FH, Vega Elite BH.




Posted By: naijachief
Date Posted: 07/11/2013 at 5:32pm
Originally posted by raphyelrosby raphyelrosby wrote:

Is that James Williams in the wheelchair? J-Wall from Atlanta?


Yes that's James.

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who no know go know


Posted By: slevin
Date Posted: 07/12/2013 at 1:19pm
Rahul, I saw 2/3 of your match with Leshxa.

You have pretty effective lateral footwork at the table, particularly how you move to make room for hitting balls to the FH side of your elbow. This kind of footwork is often seen in those who stand at the table and push with BH / loop with FH.

But now, you're using your BH loop more after developing it.

Your front - back footwork (to maximize stroke effectiveness) shall naturally improve with your increased using of the BH loop to open.

At the moment, with where you normally stand, you may be vulnerable to deep spinny long pushes to your BH diagonal. I'm sure you have thought of proper responses to them. 

In the 1st set though, Leshxa did you a favor as he did look as if he was limbering / sleep walking as compared to how he normally plays! Quite likely from all the travelling. Smile


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Posted By: NextLevel
Date Posted: 07/12/2013 at 5:12pm
Where is the video of the Rahul-Leshxa match?

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https://youtu.be/jhO4K_yFhh8?t=115" rel="nofollow - I like putting heavy topspin on the ball...
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