Backhand Flick Help
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Topic: Backhand Flick Help
Posted By: wilkinru
Subject: Backhand Flick Help
Date Posted: 08/10/2015 at 5:04pm
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Thanks to this forum I am now a bit of a pro TT junkie. One thing I'm noticing LOTS of is: the trend of the backhand flick to return serve. Now I'll back up a bit - I've been playing some "juniors" aka kids with coaches lately and when I give them a short serve that inst way into their forehand side - they instantly flick it back. They do not have a very good loop on either wing yet, but they have a very solid forehand counter, backhand counter and backhand flick - as well as a short and long serve. The backhand flick is now a staple of the modern game! In fact all reviews of rubber should include backhand flick ability. It's probably more important than a forehand loop. So - has the backhand flick just revolutionized returns in table tennis? I am feeling like I am entirely missing out on this skill! Have you seen coaches teaching juniors the backhand flick as a beginner shot? I have decided to work on flicking the crap out of everything short for the moment. Besides watching some videos - I don't know much on the technical aspect. It looks like some players really brush the side of the ball. Some players tend to lift the ball up (or both). I've been experimenting - I've been able to flick different types of spin doing the exact same motion and can even put it in both corners, but inconsistent thus far. What are the finer points to the flick? What's the best way to train this shot? |
Replies:
Posted By: berkeleydoctor
Date Posted: 08/11/2015 at 8:28am
| What really helped me was learning to hit the side of the ball rather than the back of the ball. It makes "picking" up the ball so much better. Also, hitting the ball at the top of the bounce increased my consistency. |
Posted By: berkeleydoctor
Date Posted: 08/11/2015 at 8:32am
| Also I only use my forearm for the "up" and I use the rotation of my wrist for the "forward". This is just my technique tho, I think most other people use much more forearm |
Posted By: rocketman222
Date Posted: 08/11/2015 at 8:43am
| You need a rubber wrist, and start with the face of the racket being vertically down. And good advice berkeleydoctor |
Posted By: NextLevel
Date Posted: 08/11/2015 at 8:58am
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Get a good backhand loop first. If you have one, the shot is easy (it's mostly like a backhand loop but over the table and often off the bounce). If you don't have a backhand loop, there are many ways to go wrong, though they are not all bad shots (some of the ways to go wrong are actually pretty good). ------------- https://youtu.be/jhO4K_yFhh8?t=115" rel="nofollow - I like putting heavy topspin on the ball... Cybershape Carbon FH/BH: H3P 41D. Lumberjack TT, not for lovers of beautiful strokes. No time to train... |
Posted By: suds79
Date Posted: 08/11/2015 at 9:12am
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If you have a robot this is an easy exercise to practice. Just put it on backspin & have the robot serve short. I've recently picked up this shot, with RPB, and I find it pretty easy to do. But backhand has always come pretty naturally to me. I won't pretend to be at a level in coaching the shot but I'll give the following things I look for. - If you go for the shot, fully commit. I know this might sound funny but this certainly isn't a shot you can half @$$ IMO. You need a lot of wrist action and fast bat speed. Any tentative movement will kill the shot as it'll be relatively spinless. - On vs types of spin. What I look for. If I see anything other than very heavy backspin, I go into the shot fully confident. Deadball, top, side/top, doesn't matter. You come over that ball & rip it with fast wrist motion,again penholder here, and it usually lands being very aggressive. If it's some form of backspin, this is where you should try to hit the side of the ball more. That combined with the height of the serve is important. - Height of the serve is almost more important than anything. A high bouncing backspin ball doesn't really matter. When you think about it, you don't have to lift the ball very much at all to get it over the net. The ball at the height of its bounce is usually right at the height of the net or higher. So if the ball is high? Go for it. If it's a low serve, that's where you have to quickly decide if you can hit it or not. I usually get in my position to hit the shot no matter what. If I decide it's very low & lots of backspin, from that position it's easy enough to stick out the blade and push instead. Get out there & practice it. Yes, take pointers but try not to get caught up in the step by step technique as that'll make your swing robotic & stiff. I always suggest try to watch very good players do it and with out verbal instruction going on in your head, mimic what you see. Pay attention to details. Best of luck. Here you go. Edit: URL for some reason isn't linking to 35:29. That's the spot you need. |
Posted By: wilkinru
Date Posted: 08/11/2015 at 4:33pm
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Thanks for the advice, I tried the side of the ball today, seems pretty effective. In some ways it is easier to do than a backhand loop because the ball is going so slowly. I need to work on fully committing my feet to the shot. |
Posted By: Leftyy
Date Posted: 08/11/2015 at 5:12pm
This is two great advice! I have trained much on these two particular things when training backhand flick during multi ball.
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berkeleydoctor wrote:Posted By: Baal
Date Posted: 08/12/2015 at 9:07am
| I was going to write the same thing. Hit towards the side of the ball. |
Posted By: Ringer84
Date Posted: 08/12/2015 at 9:27am
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Hinse's video is pretty good. You can really see the difference between how he approaches the ball with no spin and how he approaches the ball with backspin. But you're probably going to need a really good coach if you want to develop this shot to a high level. Most U-2000 players that I play have some weak version of this stroke that doesn't really accomplish much... me included. They would be better off just developing a high quality push against the under and side-under serves, but that's just not as cool as a banana flick I guess. I would not try to learn this shot until you can do all of the following: 1. BH loop against both push and block consistently. 2. A strong deep push with good spin and placement. 3. A good drop shot off of underspin and side-underspin serves. But I'm just spouting off on something I probably shouldn't. I personally can do all three of the things listed above, but I'm still not satisfied with the quality of the shots and my ability to perform them against different amounts of spin. So I'm putting off developing my BH banana flick until I can...
------------- USATT Rating: 1785 Timo Boll Spirit FH: Andro Rasant BH: Baracuda |
Posted By: NextLevel
Date Posted: 08/13/2015 at 5:11am
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Ringer84, Just do it. Or else, you will lack the instincts even when you develop the stroke. I should be in MD in September (may do HCTT) so we can meet up. NL ------------- https://youtu.be/jhO4K_yFhh8?t=115" rel="nofollow - I like putting heavy topspin on the ball... Cybershape Carbon FH/BH: H3P 41D. Lumberjack TT, not for lovers of beautiful strokes. No time to train... |
Posted By: NextLevel
Date Posted: 08/13/2015 at 5:13am
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Wilkinru, I forgot you were a TTEdge member. Look at lesson A1. ------------- https://youtu.be/jhO4K_yFhh8?t=115" rel="nofollow - I like putting heavy topspin on the ball... Cybershape Carbon FH/BH: H3P 41D. Lumberjack TT, not for lovers of beautiful strokes. No time to train... |
Posted By: wilkinru
Date Posted: 08/13/2015 at 2:10pm
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I did do that NL - thanks! I also begged Brett to make a tutorial...he said he would. Also found an older pingskills video about it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S5OtcmQE0aQ Lastly, I totally disagree with the idea that a 'club level' flick cannot be useful and effective. That sort of thinking is like - why bother with a flat serve at all. Everyone can attack it! Variation in your game is always good to have. At worst case, it blows away the lower level players and allows you to save energy for the other players in your round robin. At best case it can mess up the plan of the other player and apply pressure on both sides of the ball - and a good push some of the time can also really make things difficult. Another benefit: doubles. I hit a couple of clean winners in doubles today with the flick. Was it real good? No, but it was good enough to really confuse my opponent. The next serve went into the net too :) |
Posted By: Ringer84
Date Posted: 08/13/2015 at 2:49pm
To clarify, I am talking about trying to banana flip against underspin and side-underspin serves. Trying to banana flip those serves before your backhand loop is fully developed is a bad idea. I know from personal experience. If we are talking about side-topspin or deadball serves, then yes, you should be flicking those. You don't want to be in the habit of pushing those type of serves. ------------- USATT Rating: 1785 Timo Boll Spirit FH: Andro Rasant BH: Baracuda |
Posted By: V-Griper
Date Posted: 08/13/2015 at 2:53pm
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Link to post i made about this- http://mytabletennis.net/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=71085&KW=Petr+Korbel+loop&PID=868148&title=banana-na-na-na#868148" rel="nofollow - http://mytabletennis.net/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=71085&KW=Petr+Korbel+loop&PID=868148&title=banana-na-na-na#868148 I will just reiterate that grip matters if your going copy the CN methods. Some vid references- ------------- DHS 301 Xiom Vega 7pro FH/BH |
Posted By: wilkinru
Date Posted: 08/13/2015 at 5:51pm
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Ringer, you may very well be correct. I'll have to experiment a little. Thankfully there is lots of non-backspin balls to torture :) |
Posted By: asifgunz
Date Posted: 08/14/2015 at 10:25pm
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I watch fan zhendong youtube gameplay videos, and slow down the video in the speed settings. (.5 instead of 1.0) I would like to add that The footwork is a must. If youre a righty, right foot in front of the left. The rest comes naturally to me. I also realized that my 2 year old sigma 2 pro flicked 10x better than my ovp on bh. Maybe its just me. All the comments here are very very detailed and i also watched the posted videos back when I was learning the technique. Also I have realized the weakness of the bh flick while learning the technique. it will also demand better serves. All in all, it is making tt a much more competitive game. Learning never ends. Good luck. -------------  "I do not have any idols. I am my own idol." - Zhang Jike Feedback: http://mytabletennis.net/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=71761&PN=1#905629 |