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"Pull" loop technique

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patlu08 View Drop Down
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    Posted: 12/01/2007 at 6:56pm
Hey guys, Its been a long time since I have had a real lesson...

I got it with my friend and his dad, they just got back from a 6 month trip to china for table tennis. My friend is 16 years old, and his USATT rating is 2300

Myself I'm just a recreational player... people say I'm 1400 equivalent.

Heres some tips that I received:

-When practicing always return to neutral position by making an oval... or circle. Don't just go up and down... practice of the recovery motion is important. This goes for all shots, it was quite awkward doing it for backhand loops... You can see that players like wang li qin do this when warming up before a match.

-Heres the main thing that his dad said they got in china :

when looping, "pull" the ball, don't just try to rub it or smash it. Pull it over to a target spot. Its a natural feeling, and there should be only 1 arm-length that will get you max power. extend the arm too long, or have it too short and all the power will be gone. So, don't adjust your arm length, move your legs to the spot and use the same stroke.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote alfie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/01/2007 at 7:49pm
I personally can't get any power when looping chicken wing arm like Boll,I have to use my full arm like WLQ
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote O! Ju Qian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/01/2007 at 7:58pm
if there's sweetspot for blades, then there's definitely an arm position that allows you do most of the strokes. i do not extend my arm or keep it too close to my body. there's a point in space where your arm feels comfortable to be in.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kim_taek_soo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/02/2007 at 12:46am
It also depends on the grip.
I think that penholders have an easier time hitting shots that are too far into their body, whereas shakehanders can hit shots that are too far from the body. Due to the nature of the crossover point, the two styles have naturally different arm positions. But then there are acceptions like Boll (chicken wings) and Kim Taek Soo, who swings with a perfectly staight arm every time.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote theman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/02/2007 at 12:50am
hey guys would u acknowledge that i started the "chicken wings " term? or was it someone who posted something like yrs ago? just curious
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BobTheBuilder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/02/2007 at 1:14am
Originally posted by theman theman wrote:

hey guys would u acknowledge that i started the "chicken wings " term? or was it someone who posted something like yrs ago? just curious


does it really matter?
though the chicken wing thing is a pretty good analogy.


neway. i've never really put any effort into recovery but thats an excellent suggestion. i should try what u just pointed out.





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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lildudejds Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/02/2007 at 1:30am
What's your friends name?

Not asking to be a weiner and say " i want proof", i just am wondering if i know of him.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote patlu08 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/02/2007 at 2:01am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WLiqin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/02/2007 at 4:36am
In chinese they use a term called "lai" which means pull in chinese and i think that is what your friend's dad was trying to explain to you. When you pull the ball your basically looping it and driving it (loop driving) thus giving you pace and spin while looping the the direction you want it giving you control as well. It is true that your stroke should be consistent and that your footwork should be good enough so that you can position yourself every time you are given a shot, and execute you stroke the same as every other time. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PingPangQiu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/02/2007 at 4:40am
isnt lai come?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WLiqin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/02/2007 at 4:49am
well u know what i mean...it sounds like lye in english...and yes it has different pronunciation in chinese which gives "lai" two different meanings. Its almost like where and were in english...but the one im using is pull not come.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PingPangQiu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/02/2007 at 5:17am
oh the higher lai i thought you meant to lower lai
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote shermit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/02/2007 at 5:34am
actually to pull is 'la' 拉 (no 'i')
and come is 'lai' 来
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote yuna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/02/2007 at 6:37am
could it be the 'cupping' kind of loop-drive technique ??

in chinese terms, its call 'bao4' qiu. basically means cupping the ball.
while inparting spin, u 'direct' the ball to hit the spot u want.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PingPangQiu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/02/2007 at 6:49am
wrap is a better term for bao
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cheung88 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/02/2007 at 10:13am
Thats mandarin, i think he is saying pull in cantonese which is lai.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote patlu08 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/02/2007 at 2:38pm
Yeah wliqin has it right, its like a drive loop. Its a good mentality to have; i used to concentrate on wrapping, but my shots lacked power.

Thinking about pulling the ball really helped with power.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JRSDallas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/02/2007 at 2:50pm
Timothy is very good.  I played him a couple of times just after he got back and saw him play again last week. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote O! Ju Qian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/02/2007 at 2:54pm
i was thinking about the lai term that women use.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KLHfans Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/07/2007 at 6:15pm

Hi Patlu:

         I find that Timothy Wang  was rated around 1624 in 7/22/2006
and he is 2306 now. In 1.5 years.. he went up closed to 700 point.
What is the secret for his incredible improvement rate and where
did he get his training in China or US coach in Texas?
 
Thank you.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote patlu08 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/07/2007 at 8:46pm
Originally posted by KLHfans KLHfans wrote:

Hi Patlu:

         I find that Timothy Wang  was rated around 1624 in 7/22/2006
and he is 2306 now. In 1.5 years.. he went up closed to 700 point.
What is the secret for his incredible improvement rate and where
did he get his training in China or US coach in Texas?
 
Thank you.
 
Klhfans


He trained in China with his dad over the Summer.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote T  h  e  N  A M Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/08/2007 at 5:34pm
Originally posted by JRSDallas JRSDallas wrote:

Timothy is very good.  I played him a couple of times just after he got back and saw him play again last week. 
 
were you at the txwes tournament last week?
 
what is your name..?
 
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote checkmilu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/09/2007 at 8:13pm

yeah, trying to move after the ball and use your most favourite stroke is good. However, in many situation, you just can't move quick enough, not because you're slow, but you opponent is tricky, then you need to be able to have effective off balance strokes. Malin is the best example of unusual hits.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cole_ely Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/10/2007 at 9:13am
This idea of pulling the ball on a loop makes me think that I should wait for the loop to get out beside my body, as opposed to taking the ball in front of me. Is that part of this concept? Letting the ball get a bit further by you?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PingPangQiu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/10/2007 at 6:03pm
i think its just letting yourself remember to rub the ball more and as much as you can just like your pulling it across and not slapping it over
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote patlu08 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/10/2007 at 6:09pm
yeah cole, i think the technique requires the ball to be more at your side and not infront.

and actually he told me to not concentrate on rubbing the ball, the pull mentality sort of balances spin/power/speed, and it feels realllllllllllly natural. His dad says it should feel like the most natural stroke ever.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote T2Russo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/10/2007 at 6:15pm
I came to understanding this technique more from just doing what felt more comfortable. �It's almost like you sling the ball forward, as opposed to putting all of the energy into it in a quick, fast, and sharp motion, like with hitting or blocking.

Letting it get further past you is important, otherwise you are extending forward already and don't have a lot of room to whip the ball forward. �Flat hits are much the opposite for me, as I whip only the bat forward and contact the ball with the bat at maximum speed, while minimizing contact time.

This really explains why people tend to like springier blades for looping, as they flex a bit allowing for the dwell time to be higher and them to get more of the slingshot feeling.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ProfessorChaos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/14/2007 at 6:39pm
Originally posted by theman theman wrote:

hey guys would u acknowledge that i started the "chicken wings " term? or was it someone who posted something like yrs ago? just curious


i know some top rated canadian players who use that term when referring to the dropped-wrist, hence chicken wing style...

no you did not start the term...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote alindo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/14/2007 at 8:31pm
Hi,
Could anybody post a video clip showing this "pool" technique
Thanks,
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote timmyxwang Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01/05/2008 at 3:33am
hmmmm..... thanks patrick... for discussing my secret coaching methods on this forum for the whole world to see... u have dishonored my family's secret techniques and u must be killed! no im kidding.... i really appreciate that. anyways hmmm who are these ppl who know/seen me... i feel like im being stalked now... yeahhhhhhhhhhhh but anyways if u guys have any questions feel free to ask me XD

ps... how do i show off all my cool equipment and stuff on the bottom like everyone else?

edit: pss i cant find a sponsor... so if anyone has any connections or any idea on how i can find a sponsor please tell me. im a male, 16 years old, rated 2332
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