|
|
Question about Chinese players |
Post Reply |
Author | |
T1moBoll
Member Joined: 11/21/2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 6 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Posted: 06/26/2007 at 3:48pm |
Why do most players on the Chinese national team use Chinese rubber on their forehand side but non-Chinese rubber on their backhand side? For example, a common setup is DHS Hurricane 3 on forehand and some variety of Butterfly's Sriver on their backhand side? Thanks.
|
|
Sponsored Links | |
Wawaicetea123
Gold Member Joined: 03/11/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1070 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
all players use and like diffrent combinations according to ther personal style. the reason for most chinese players to have chinese rubber ont her forhand is that they want to create alot of spin and is most commenely used as an attacking rubber on the fh and on the back hand to block and counter with the reason almost all players use jap/euro rubber on the back hand is that it is much easier to control and is more forgiveing than chinese rubber
|
|
calvinding
Member Joined: 09/23/2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 28 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Jap/Euro rubber tends to have softer sponges which cause the ball to come off the paddle faster and with more momentum. In order to compensate for their perceived lack of backhand strength, Chinese players use Jap/Euro rubbers.
I disagree with the previous post which insinuates that Jap/Euro rubbers are more forgiving. Because they are usually not as tacky as say, H3, there is actually a lesser ability to control the ball (like spin, placement, etc...) with Jap/Euro rubbers. |
|
CDing
Blade: BTY TBS FH: Skyline III BH: Sriver EL |
|
reachie85
Super Member Joined: 02/11/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 470 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
my perception is that the chinese rubbers allow for more variety of strokes. it's easier to graze loop with a lot of chinese rubbers, and of course you can also hit, drive, and mechanical loop with them. they would be the rubber of choice if i was to initiate an attack.
euro/jap rubbers tend to be easier to control in the sense of you can be slightly less sensitive about adjusting your paddle angle, thus making for an easier rubber for blocking. also i find that some of the chinese rubbers to be faster during hard hits, jap/euro rubbers usually feature softer sponges which makes for faster speed with light hits. the chinese rubbers i've tried never felt like they bottom out, the harder i hit, the more acceleration the sponge provides. i haven't tried too many jap/euro rubbers, but the tackifire special i've tried seem to bottom out rather easily. |
|
BL: Yasaka Ma Lin Extra Offensive CPen
FH: Haifu Blue Whale 2 BH: Nittaku Nodias |
|
Wawaicetea123
Gold Member Joined: 03/11/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1070 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
99/100 people will agree that jap/euro rubber is moreforgiveing, easier to use, and more stable
It is known that to produce powerful drives and smashes, a player should use a hard sponge and make the ball dig into the sponge. However, if a player with a weak swing uses a hard rubber, when the ball makes impact with the rubber, it does not dig into the sponge - which makes it difficult to control the ball. A RUBBER WITH A HARD SPONGE
When you use a rubber with a hard sponge, it is hard to make the ball dig into the rubber, causing the direction of the ball to become unstable. Therefore, it is hard to control the ball.
A RUBBER WITH A SOFT SPONGE
When you use a rubber with a soft sponge, it is easier to make the ball dig into the rubber causing the direction of the ball to be stable. Therefore it is easier to control the ball.
trust me on this one
|
|
kenneyy88
Premier Member Joined: 01/06/2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 4074 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
where did u get those pictures
|
|
Marcelob
Beginner Joined: 09/17/2006 Location: Mexico Status: Offline Points: 73 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Very nice pictures wawaicetea123, thanks for clarifying that ;)
MB |
|
Tibhar Dynamic 7
FH Rapid X-Press (2.0) BH Rapid X-Press (2.0) |
|
BobTheBuilder
Super Member Joined: 09/24/2006 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 102 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
the pictures come from the butterfly online site...
advertising the solcion? yar. the solcion. |
|
Yasaka Extra Offensive C-Pen
FH: TG2 Neo Black BH: Focus III Snipe Red |
|
dimitris
Silver Member Joined: 02/16/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 852 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
I do not see any proof in made up pictures, it could very well be the second picture showing the ball jumping in some other direction and the first going straight. And sounds also like claiming that a person jumping on a matress controls better his direction than a person jumping on solid floor, which I cannot also believe without solid arguments. Any theory to support such claims except easily controlled drawings? Have you ever considered the possibility for example of the euro/japanese rubbers, being more expensive and maybe having better quality control, to have less inconsistency in the density of their material? For absolutely homogeneous rubber and sponge I do not see any reason for any rubber to alter the bouncing angle in unpredictable ways without spin...
|
|
Pip Master
Silver Member Joined: 02/12/2006 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 678 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
well frankly if you dont agree with wawaicetea , you are insanely ignorant, as wawacetea said before, its common knowledge.
|
|
Blade:Yasaka Gatien Extra 3D
FH: Mendo MP BH: Sriver EL |
|
Wawaicetea123
Gold Member Joined: 03/11/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1070 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
yes
the pictures are from the solicon advertisement
but they are completly true and help prove the point
and quality control has absolutly nothing to do with how well you can control the ball there is never a hard chinese rubber that gos below 38 degrees
it is known knowlage that chinese rubber is used for harder swinging players with more racket speed but, no one in their right mind would say a chinese rubber has better control in the short or speed game its pure stupidity and lack of knowledge and lack of use of the rubbers
thank you all who know and agree with me also
|
|
Pip Master
Silver Member Joined: 02/12/2006 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 678 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
well i just realized that i don't completely agree with you. i personally think that hard rubbers give better touch and control, but this is just personal preference. however, it's true that they are less forgiving, a slight change in technique will have more noticeable impacts on a hard rubber than a soft one.
|
|
Blade:Yasaka Gatien Extra 3D
FH: Mendo MP BH: Sriver EL |
|
Wawaicetea123
Gold Member Joined: 03/11/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1070 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
i was just about to say myself
that all of my posts are my ideas
nothing is fact and i dont mean to be mean
or ignorant myself im soryr if i affended you
this is just my thoughts
|
|
Budric
Super Member Joined: 03/06/2006 Status: Offline Points: 157 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Agree. The pictures are completely arbitrary. The spin on the ball is not shown, so that alone makes the pictures completely useless. This is marketing hype, the same as every single rubber advertised has "tremendous touch, feel, control and power" Modeling this kind of collision is insanely hard, and if you guys think the pictures are proof of anything you're the ignorant ones. P.S. The pictures are also misleading because of gravity. Think about setting up a rubber on a flat surface instead, then dropping a ball straight onto it from some height (no spin). Anyone think that the ball will deflect left/right for some rubbers? Why? |
|
yogi_bear
Forum Moderator Joined: 11/25/2004 Location: Philippines Status: Offline Points: 7219 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
one thing about euro/jap rubbers as more forgiving.. i think sticky rubbers have a tendency to react more on incoming spin than euro jap non tacky rubbers.. i also think that the level of the player affects on how he uses both chinese and euro rubbers so its kinda broad
|
|
Independent online TT Product reviewer of XIOM, STIGA, JOOLA, SANWEI, GEWO, AIR, ITC, APEX, YASAKA and ABROS
ITTF Level 1 Coaching Course Conductor, ITTF Level 1 Coach |
|
a11291994
Member Joined: 02/27/2007 Status: Offline Points: 33 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
I think its because they have more control with forehand so they use fast rubbers like hurricane 2 or 3. But china dosent have many control rubbers.
|
|
Blade: Boll Tricarbon
FH: Hurricane 2 2.0 BH: Sriver 1.7 |
|
TT_Freak
Platinum Member Joined: 11/21/2004 Status: Offline Points: 2672 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Chinese rubbers tend to produce very heavy balls, since the intense spin gives a "kick" to the ball when it hits the table. Bryce when glued up is similar, but thats because it "skips" on the table.
Also, rubbers like Hurricane 3 don't bottom or top out, the harder you hit the faster and spinnier the ball is. That makes it a wonderful rubber for the horde of fast attackers in China. Though players like Kong Linghui and Ma Lin who still want variation have different topsheets that gets rid of that H3 spin+speed feel. |
|
Violin
F1 Actor 10g at 3 and 9 10g at 12 20g at the end of handle |
|
kmh888
Super Member Joined: 12/28/2006 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 187 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
''When you use a rubber with a hard sponge, it is hard to make the ball dig into the rubber, causing the direction of the ball to become unstable. Therefore, it is hard to control the ball.''
then why is it so easy ( and this isnt just me) to block balls with a hurricane 3?
|
|
Gatien Extra
FH: Hurricane Provincial BH: Palio CJ800 Speed Special thick glue |
|
Wawaicetea123
Gold Member Joined: 03/11/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1070 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
im pretty sure every one iwll agree that hard rubber is good to block with
but im not really sure why
i think its becouse the ball dosnt sink so deep into the sponge and dosnt catapult back or spring back
|
|
mafia
Super Member Joined: 06/24/2004 Location: Malaysia Status: Offline Points: 394 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
>>>>Why do most players on the Chinese national team use Chinese rubber on their forehand side but non-Chinese rubber on their backhand side? For example, a common setup is DHS Hurricane 3 on forehand and some variety of Butterfly's Sriver on their backhand side?
I think this is something to do with
1) The charecteric of Chinese rubber, tacky surface & hard sponge, not easily to produce speed.
2) Back hand is always weaker than forehand
As such, they can use their powerful fore hand to generate the speed, and
making use the powerful sponge on Jap/Euro rubber for the speed on backhand
|
|
Maze ST
FH/BH : Palio Era 42.5 Max |
|
Jolan
Gold Member Joined: 01/14/2005 Location: France Status: Offline Points: 1299 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
I'm not sure it's a matter of hardness or softness. These two items belong to the speed range. Tackiness and gripness are more relevant. Since BH usual game is based on blocks, mostly in the learning years, euro/japs rubbers that are less tacky and therefore do not "eat" oponent's spin as much as chineses. That's what some mean about forgiveness. I know a lot of you won't agree, but blocking with sriver is easier than with H3 (I've had both). Then, when years go by, habits are taken and it's hard to change. |
|
Joola Wyzaryz Freeze
Vega pro 2.0mm Vega intro 2.0mm Blade collection : https://photos.app.goo.gl/PrgCu5ib5RnhVXTn9 |
|
bbkon
Premier Member Joined: 04/19/2005 Location: Afghanistan Status: Offline Points: 7260 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
1 main reason to use chinese rubber on fh is that low arc loops are generated therefore is harder to re loop
2
2 weight (kong in his younger days use to play with 2 globe 999)
3 japanese on bh is easier to stop loops, so you get 2 diferent kind of loops of 2 wings and is easier to get great spin of bh wing
|
|
Jack87
Super Member Joined: 01/18/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 309 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Yogi and bbkon nailed the main two reasons on the head:
1) Most players have a perceived or calculated ideal weight for their setup. Most Chinese fast attack rubbers are very heavy. Therefore, adding a Euro style rubber on the bh addresses the weight issues. 2) Tackier rubber IS more sensitive to incoming spin, much in the same way that it is more appropriate for graze looping then non-tacky rubbers. A slightly misjudged racket angle is more likely to be an acceptable shot off a non-tacky rubber then a tacky one. Due to the limitations of the human hand / wrist / arm, the fine motor control of the backhand is slightly less then the forehand (hence most pros being forehand-dominant). There has to be a reason, no? These are the best players in the world, and I'm pretty sure they wouldn't just put Sriver on the bh for the hell of it. - Jack - PS. The Solcion pics are.... sort of right. A very soft sponged rubber will have more dwell on loops. Therefore lower level players (with considerably less handspeed) will be able to impart more topspin then they could with harder sponged rubbers. I realize this is partly preference, but it is entirely logical that it would be easier to control high-spin, low-speed loops with a softer sponge, from a purely physical standpoint. |
|
Gambler Kevlar ST
Nittaku Refoma (1.5mm) Yasaka Phantom 011 (OX) |
|
calvinding
Member Joined: 09/23/2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 28 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Would I be able to have the best of both worlds if I use tacky surfaced rubber with japanese sponge?... like the nittaku joint venture rubbers with dhs?
|
|
CDing
Blade: BTY TBS FH: Skyline III BH: Sriver EL |
|
Post Reply | |
Tweet
|
Forum Jump | Forum Permissions You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot create polls in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum |
Forum Home | Go to the Forums | Forum Help | Disclaimer
MyTableTennis.NET is the trading name of Alex Table Tennis Ltd. |