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Kokutaku Tuple 007 Pro

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    Posted: 02/18/2020 at 12:01pm
Thanks for the response; yes, the rubber obviously gets softer over time, and the tackiness needs to be preserved by a good rubber care.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote achoomai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/14/2020 at 7:43pm
From my experience , topsheet of this rubber is quite durable which is almost 5 month now. The tackiness is not like new but still grip the ball well. Below is my method to taking care the rubber

Normally , cleaning with clean water to rove the dust is good enough and always use plastic film to cover the topsheet after play. This is to avoid oxidation on topsheet. Special care like foam or other chemical can be used only 1-2 times a week should be sufficient. 

The most important is always using plastic cover sheet after playing and not overclean the topsheet.
My feedback : http://www.mytabletennis.net/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=58844&PN=1#726094
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote darkmoor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02/14/2020 at 6:43pm
Hello folks, has any of you experienced losing some tack on your Kokutaku 007 Pro.Selected rubber over some, rather short, time?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote achoomai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/04/2019 at 10:49pm
pm sent
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Static Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/04/2019 at 7:43pm
Originally posted by yogi_bear yogi_bear wrote:


Contact achoomai the forum member here. 

Just did, cheers.
Nittaku Violin, FH: Xiom Vega X, BH: Andro Hexer Powergrip SFX
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote achoomai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/04/2019 at 7:33pm
No 38 degree available.
Only red 40 degree available for now.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote yogi_bear Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/04/2019 at 7:26pm
Originally posted by Static Static wrote:

Is this rubber available to buy anywhere as of now? I'm quite curious to give it a try. 

Contact achoomai the forum member here. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote yogi_bear Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/04/2019 at 7:25pm
Originally posted by icontek icontek wrote:

DAY 3: Tulpe 007 Pro Blue Sponge (38D?) Impressions

2 Hours, forehand drilling including loop and block - still unboosted

1) Here comes the noise
a) big chinese crack sound showed up
b) rubber plays more like a Spinnier Sanwei Target National
2) Throw is getting a little longer, deeper arc
a) Speed of the rubber sheet has continued to pick up.
b) Spin is still very, very good

3) In spite of my fears about marrying an elastic sponge to a tacky topsheet, there is still some very linear output from the rubber

During drilling, I noticed that I that blade face adjustments (angle) provided very direct changes the to spin and depth of my shots. Closing the face made my shots land shorter, and spinnier - opening the face was deeper and faster. When I say direct, I mean that the changes in arc felt very linear and predictable; I could use the same stroke, while just varying the contact point, to deceive opponent better.
Yogi is probably right about boosting the rubber. But he is a much higher level player! 

And I wanted to give some perspective for someone at the other end of the spectrum.

I consider myself as above average only and have learned the correct textbook strokes. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote yogi_bear Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/04/2019 at 7:23pm
Originally posted by icontek icontek wrote:

Originally posted by yogi_bear yogi_bear wrote:

It is still best boosted. The 38 degree version is at keast at the level of s3 speed and softness when boosted 3 layers of falco. 

Acuda S3 original?

Yup acuda s3
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Static Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/04/2019 at 6:12pm
Is this rubber available to buy anywhere as of now? I'm quite curious to give it a try. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote icontek Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/21/2019 at 8:34pm
Originally posted by yogi_bear yogi_bear wrote:

It is still best boosted. The 38 degree version is at keast at the level of s3 speed and softness when boosted 3 layers of falco. 

Acuda S3 original?
US1260.RC1042 . Avalox P500 : Tuple 007 Pro + Victas 402DE
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote icontek Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/21/2019 at 8:36am
DAY 3: Tulpe 007 Pro Blue Sponge (38D?) Impressions

2 Hours, forehand drilling including loop and block - still unboosted

1) Here comes the noise
a) big chinese crack sound showed up
b) rubber plays more like a Spinnier Sanwei Target National
2) Throw is getting a little longer, deeper arc
a) Speed of the rubber sheet has continued to pick up.
b) Spin is still very, very good

3) In spite of my fears about marrying an elastic sponge to a tacky topsheet, there is still some very linear output from the rubber

During drilling, I noticed that I that blade face adjustments (angle) provided very direct changes the to spin and depth of my shots. Closing the face made my shots land shorter, and spinnier - opening the face was deeper and faster. When I say direct, I mean that the changes in arc felt very linear and predictable; I could use the same stroke, while just varying the contact point, to deceive opponent better.
Yogi is probably right about boosting the rubber. But he is a much higher level player! 

And I wanted to give some perspective for someone at the other end of the spectrum.


Edited by icontek - 11/21/2019 at 11:23pm
US1260.RC1042 . Avalox P500 : Tuple 007 Pro + Victas 402DE
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote yogi_bear Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/17/2019 at 8:55pm
It is still best boosted. The 38 degree version is at keast at the level of s3 speed and softness when boosted 3 layers of falco. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote icontek Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/17/2019 at 2:55pm
DAY 2: Tulpe 007 Pro Blue Sponge (38D?) Impressions

2 Hours, matchplay vs Normal opponents - still UNBOOSTED

1) Speed of the rubber sheet has picked up.
a) it was easier to topspin outright winners.
b) the ball sometimes went long if I had lazy footwork and did not topspin.

2) It is still very good for inside of the table forehand attacking 
a) FH flick or loop off bounce to create short safe arc that clears net
b) sometimes the arc was so short that i was unintentionally attacking mid table.

3) Looping is starting to feel more sponge.
a) the rubber topsheet feels connected to the sponge, but you can definitely tell when the sponge speed engages
b) it was not quite as easy to do topsheet only brush

4) Spin is still VERY good. Moreso than STN, perhaps more than K1 Hybrid Euro. 
a) opponents were surprised by the side to side movement on some of my loops
b) i was surprised by how much my topspin would bring the ball down earlier than I expected

5) It is still slower on flat hitting than a Euro or Japanese rubber, but felt reliable with closed face topspin.


Day 3 will be tomorrow, I think.
Looking forward to it. 


Edited by icontek - 11/17/2019 at 3:00pm
US1260.RC1042 . Avalox P500 : Tuple 007 Pro + Victas 402DE
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote achoomai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/05/2019 at 6:28am
Thanks a lot for your feedback. Put here is fine.

Edited by achoomai - 11/05/2019 at 6:30am
My feedback : http://www.mytabletennis.net/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=58844&PN=1#726094
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote icontek Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/05/2019 at 1:12am
Achoomai -Would you like my review in this thread or as a separate thread?

Day 1


FH rubber on a new Avalox P500
2 coats of Revolution 3 Medium glue
Paired it with Rasant 1.7mm on BH for balance 
(Rasant is even heavier than classic Chinese rubber so 1.7 helps balance)

Disclaimers: 
Low level club player (rating in signature).
I can topspin from my forehand wing, I can loop with spin or drive the ball as well; smashes are not my thing.
I have played with some variant of Chinese rubber on my forehand (729, DHS, and later Sanwei Target National) for a better part of a decade. This past year I've preferred German Hybrids (like K1, which plays like a slightly boosted Chinese classic). 

Observations:
Visually, the topsheet of the 007 Pro is more similar to Sanwei Target National than Hurricane; it has a synthetic look. It is somewhat supple. The blue sponge is porous, but not as deep and rich as STN's. It is not super tacky. Freshly glued, the bounce test felt slow, like a new Chinese rubber but not as slow as H3. You can tell it will have a good short game immediately.

Playing Conditions:
5 hours of warmup, drills and matches. Mixed match results early, better later.

It felt slow to start, but very predictable. Feedback from the rubber was clear and crisp and it could create good safe arcs easily. Throw I would call medium, but spin was better than I expected. The rubber was more forgiving of poor footwork than classic Hurricanes. And when you do execute, it can generate enough pressure. If caught out of position, you can reliably still topspin balls to the table. What is very rewarding is that when you do execute good footwork and positioning, it is capable of delivering good power. Later in the evening, I was able to properly FH attack from BH corner to opponent FH line. 

First Impressions:
FEEL:
007's Chinese tacky feeling is more pronounced than DHS-made hybrids like the original Stiga Genesis M or earlier iterations like Tinarc. On the first day, it was not as linear as those rubbers, and felt more traditional Chinese Tacky (slower, short game). It also felt like 007's Japanese sponge had a bit of depth, or top end power. I was not able to bottom it out. Whereas Yasaka's Rising Dragon feels like a mushy Galaxy rubber, this feels more solid.

SPIN:
I also like the spin of 007 better than Sanwei Target National; it's much easier to vary spin with the 007. On first impression it also seems to be pretty stable for blocking on forehand drills. I really like the countertopspin with this rubber. Looping your opponents block, or even his drive is pretty easy. Short game touch is very good. I could vary service spin by using topsheet, or going high toss and using sponge. Like classic Chinese rubber,  it was possible to attack inside the table, using off the bounce loops.

SPEED:
On the first day, it was not fast. I had to work to produce speed. If you gave the ball a solid stroke, using your hip, speed was not significant. It was not as slow as classic Chinese rubbers, as the japanese sponge seems to give it some medium pace when you apply force. After 3-4 hours, when I went for it on 3rd ball attacks, it felt very Chinese. Good control and more than enough speed for shots where you use a big swing.

Notes:
-Early on I alternated matches with my normal K1 Hybrid / Victas 402DE Setup, as the evening progressed, I started to heavily favor the 007/P500 combo.
-I don't think I would need to boost this, I would not want it any softer and I am not sure that the spin would be enough to keep the arc down.
-If it plays this well after the break in period, I would probably buy another sheet.



Edited by icontek - 11/05/2019 at 4:04pm
US1260.RC1042 . Avalox P500 : Tuple 007 Pro + Victas 402DE
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Review on Amazon



Edited by achoomai - 11/03/2019 at 1:22am
My feedback : http://www.mytabletennis.net/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=58844&PN=1#726094
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote achoomai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/01/2019 at 7:49pm
Originally posted by yogi_bear yogi_bear wrote:

updated with a review for 40 degree version.
Thanks a lot.
For durability, please check again after 2 months.
My first customer used 38 degree version for 2 months now (just reboosted) and he still happy with it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote yogi_bear Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/01/2019 at 7:39pm
updated with a review for 40 degree version.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote achoomai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/01/2019 at 6:35am
Originally posted by icontek icontek wrote:

Originally posted by yogi_bear yogi_bear wrote:

His 38 degree pro 007 is already light. If you wabt lighter that will be a total downgrade among rubbers you are using. 

I am not sure who you were replying to.

Also, Achoomai mentioned using the rubber through the break in period - do you think that by the 3rd day it was fully broken in?

Compared to STN, do you think it will just play more elastic and linear?

STN seems like it wants to drive or brush, and has a loud fast driving gear, and a quieter, brushing gear. It does not flat hit well.

The 40 degree hardness version may suit for the players who like harder rubber, but not very hard.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote icontek Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/31/2019 at 9:43pm
Originally posted by yogi_bear yogi_bear wrote:

His 38 degree pro 007 is already light. If you wabt lighter that will be a total downgrade among rubbers you are using. 

I am not sure who you were replying to.

Also, Achoomai mentioned using the rubber through the break in period - do you think that by the 3rd day it was fully broken in?

Compared to STN, do you think it will just play more elastic and linear?

STN seems like it wants to drive or brush, and has a loud fast driving gear, and a quieter, brushing gear. It does not flat hit well.
US1260.RC1042 . Avalox P500 : Tuple 007 Pro + Victas 402DE
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote yogi_bear Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/29/2019 at 2:03pm
His 38 degree pro 007 is already light. If you wabt lighter that will be a total downgrade among rubbers you are using. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote icontek Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/29/2019 at 10:54am
Thanks for your great review Yogi!

STN was one of my favorite rubbers. I only gave it up when I switched to a faster 7 ply as i did not like the interaction between blade and rubber gears. STN's speed, and ease of use are it's two biggest strengths. It plays like a boosted H3 41 with training wheels. 

I was looking for something similar but lighter when I saw Achoomai's Tulpe 007 pro offer. I was curious to check on the current state of non DHS fast/tacky/elastic rubber.

I currently use K1 Hybrid, as it offers some of the classic tacky advantage (service, short game, FH flicks) and it is still able to make a safe arc with deeper trajectory if I get pushed off the table. 

Edited by icontek - 10/29/2019 at 11:07am
US1260.RC1042 . Avalox P500 : Tuple 007 Pro + Victas 402DE
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fmarek Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/29/2019 at 7:57am
Stiga Celero, FH: Hurricane 3 Pro H38, BH: DHS Skyline 3-60, H37
Viscaria, FH: Hurricane 3 Commercial H39, BH: Hurricane Neo 3 Commercial H39
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote yogi_bear Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/29/2019 at 7:31am
You can search it in ttd website
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fmarek Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/29/2019 at 4:13am
Where can I find your review?
Stiga Celero, FH: Hurricane 3 Pro H38, BH: DHS Skyline 3-60, H37
Viscaria, FH: Hurricane 3 Commercial H39, BH: Hurricane Neo 3 Commercial H39
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote yogi_bear Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/29/2019 at 3:48am
I have reviewed the blue packaged STN's already or the ones named Sanwei Target National Pro Blue rubbers. It is basically have a new sponge which is faster and with a lower throw or arc. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fmarek Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/28/2019 at 10:06pm
Mate, I am not questioning your credibility or knowledge. I am fairly new to all this. I got surprised that STN is pre-tuned, as it does not look like one. So if you source is rubber designer I take it as an answer :)

In any case rubber is a big find to me, I like it the way it is, would not bother soaking it into any more oils :)

Bth do you know anything about these blue packaged new Sanwei Target Provincial's? 
Stiga Celero, FH: Hurricane 3 Pro H38, BH: DHS Skyline 3-60, H37
Viscaria, FH: Hurricane 3 Commercial H39, BH: Hurricane Neo 3 Commercial H39
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote yogi_bear Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/28/2019 at 7:44pm
I was informed by a rubber designer and blade maker before. By the way, the curling that i am talking abiut is not the u shaped or bowl shaped curling but rather the rubber does not have an entirely flwt look. Also, did you notice the semi oily part of the sponge? Part of the reaeon why a rubber shrinks aside from too much rolling when attacing is that the amount of factory boosting evaporates. A eponge without boost is only limited by the time it has the boost. This is why you will notic3 after a few weeks, there will be changes in the playing characteristics if the rubber. This is more evident among esn rubbers but chinese rubbers especially the medium priced ones also have tuner but in a little amount just to give the rubber some.l juice but also to avoid going the specificed amount of voc. The vacuum packed rubbers before have a faster rate of voc evaporation that is why they have to be sealed. By the way, i have had more than 20+ STN used and I was the one who introduced it to this forum and in ttd in 2014 or 15.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fmarek Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/28/2019 at 7:41am
I dealt with 6 STN rubbers and none had any curling. The package is this (or without any face) https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32619511193.html 

So you just assuming it is tuned or have some information about it?
Stiga Celero, FH: Hurricane 3 Pro H38, BH: DHS Skyline 3-60, H37
Viscaria, FH: Hurricane 3 Commercial H39, BH: Hurricane Neo 3 Commercial H39
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