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[video] please USATT rate me or any tips

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ByeByeAbout Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 10:11am
Originally posted by murraylp2 murraylp2 wrote:

Originally posted by smackman smackman wrote:

I feel sorry for the op when all this side tracking rubbish goes on, it's his tread and just asking about himself

I think ive started some sort of mass political warfare :/

How ever does the fun sport of table tennis lead men onto fighting about US ego!


hi murray

glad you're getting someone useful information.  we love video around here...post some more when you get the chance.  

ego came into because you introduced it with your original question...unwittingly im sure.. (fwiw)

regards
rick
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Originally posted by murraylp2 murraylp2 wrote:

Personally I though my footwork was pretty good, or atleast for my level. As im young I can move alot faster than older or overweight men in many tournaments. I do agree however that i need alot of work to improve forehand, and my backhand is already pretty good, just need to, as was suggested, use it to attack more than block.

I guess ill try a variety of forehand routines today
This video is from a recent tournament 2 13 year olds playing: Kanak Jha has excellent footwork (Blue). Might help to watch them.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 10:27am
Originally posted by jrscatman jrscatman wrote:

Why not suggest to learn to play like pushblocker! The question OP asked was how to improve his game - not win. No, my coach doesn't have to move to beat me, another coach beat me sitting on a chair - but do they teach those techniques - NO! Racquet sports - most important thing is footwork - it's probably true for every other sport. To say learn to loop without proper footwork - is plain wrong! 

I think you are missing the point and drawing too many parallels to other sports where there is much more ground to cover to play.   OP has good movement.  He is 15 already - unless he decided to dedicate his life to table tennis, the boat of top level footwork and form has largely passed him by.  If he had access to the right kind of coaching, he would not be on this website.

Why would anyone be telling him to blindly(without information) emulate Kanak Jha who basically plays Table Tennis ALL the time and is the most talented junior in the US?

VGriper pointed out that OP's paddle is too open for most of his shots - that is linked to his stroke technique - if he knew how to generate heavy topspin (or the benefits of doing so), he wouldn't be doing that.

Strokes, strokes, strokes...  anything that makes your stroke better and more consistent should be the focus.

In fact, when you have the right stroke, you want to move to the ball because you know you have a chance of returning it with quality.  When you don't, you let the ball go because you know that even if you touch it, you aren't putting it on the table.


Edited by NextLevel - 04/18/2014 at 10:30am
I like putting heavy topspin on the ball...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ByeByeAbout Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 10:31am
Originally posted by jrscatman jrscatman wrote:

Originally posted by murraylp2 murraylp2 wrote:

Personally I though my footwork was pretty good, or atleast for my level. As im young I can move alot faster than older or overweight men in many tournaments. I do agree however that i need alot of work to improve forehand, and my backhand is already pretty good, just need to, as was suggested, use it to attack more than block.

I guess ill try a variety of forehand routines today
This video is from a recent tournament 2 13 year olds playing: Kanak Jha has excellent footwork (Blue). Might help to watch them.



great clip...love jha's bh...fearless.  the two points he makes at 10-10 to win are superb.

regards
rick
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ByeByeAbout Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 10:40am
"
Originally posted by jrscatman

He is 15 already - unless he decided to dedicate his life to table tennis, the boat of top level footwork and form has largely passed him by."

this is 100% incorrect statement.   ignore this.


If he had access to the right kind of coaching, he would not be on this website.

this is also 100% incorrect.  ignore this nonsense.

Why would anyone be telling him to blindly(without information) emulate Kanak Jha who basically plays Table Tennis ALL the time and is the most talented junior in the US?

you're right....he should emulate a real player....like pushblocker.

your other points are good and duly noted.

regards
rick


Edited by ByeByeAbout - 04/18/2014 at 10:41am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jrscatman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 10:50am
Originally posted by NextLevel NextLevel wrote:

Originally posted by jrscatman jrscatman wrote:

Why not suggest to learn to play like pushblocker! The question OP asked was how to improve his game - not win. No, my coach doesn't have to move to beat me, another coach beat me sitting on a chair - but do they teach those techniques - NO! Racquet sports - most important thing is footwork - it's probably true for every other sport. To say learn to loop without proper footwork - is plain wrong! 

I think you are missing the point and drawing too many parallels to other sports where there is much more ground to cover to play.   OP has good movement.  He is 15 already - unless he decided to dedicate his life to table tennis, the boat of top level footwork and form has largely passed him by.  If he had access to the right kind of coaching, he would not be on this website.

Why would anyone be telling him to blindly(without information) emulate Kanak Jha who basically plays Table Tennis ALL the time and is the most talented junior in the US?

VGriper pointed out that OP's paddle is too open for most of his shots - that is linked to his stroke technique - if he knew how to generate heavy topspin (or the benefits of doing so), he wouldn't be doing that.

Strokes, strokes, strokes...  anything that makes your stroke better and more consistent should be the focus.

In fact, when you have the right stroke, you want to move to the ball because you know you have a chance of returning it with quality.  When you don't, you let the ball go because you know that even if you touch it, you aren't putting it on the table.
Well we'll have to agree to disagree on this one Nextlevel. In my opinion - if you're feet are not in the proper position - there is no way you can hit a proper stroke. But if you've found a way to do that might want to teach it.
I linked the Khank Jha - video because they are about the same age and in my opinion Jha has very good movement and good stroke mechanics - thought would be a good example of proper form and technique. 


Edited by jrscatman - 04/18/2014 at 10:50am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Whang Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 11:05am
I think you'd still be able to hit a decent stroke even if your feet are out of position, like chasing hard-to-reach balls...you'd just have to compensate the strength you get from proper foot work and instead use good upper body, arm, or even wrist technique...proper footwork will make shots easier to execute and make it easier to produce good quality shots, yes, but also help you get better balance, better recovery, etc., which is harder to get after a quality shot but wrong footwork...just my opinion though
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 11:53am
Originally posted by jrscatman jrscatman wrote:

Originally posted by NextLevel NextLevel wrote:

Originally posted by jrscatman jrscatman wrote:

Why not suggest to learn to play like pushblocker! The question OP asked was how to improve his game - not win. No, my coach doesn't have to move to beat me, another coach beat me sitting on a chair - but do they teach those techniques - NO! Racquet sports - most important thing is footwork - it's probably true for every other sport. To say learn to loop without proper footwork - is plain wrong! 

I think you are missing the point and drawing too many parallels to other sports where there is much more ground to cover to play.   OP has good movement.  He is 15 already - unless he decided to dedicate his life to table tennis, the boat of top level footwork and form has largely passed him by.  If he had access to the right kind of coaching, he would not be on this website.

Why would anyone be telling him to blindly(without information) emulate Kanak Jha who basically plays Table Tennis ALL the time and is the most talented junior in the US?

VGriper pointed out that OP's paddle is too open for most of his shots - that is linked to his stroke technique - if he knew how to generate heavy topspin (or the benefits of doing so), he wouldn't be doing that.

Strokes, strokes, strokes...  anything that makes your stroke better and more consistent should be the focus.

In fact, when you have the right stroke, you want to move to the ball because you know you have a chance of returning it with quality.  When you don't, you let the ball go because you know that even if you touch it, you aren't putting it on the table.
Well we'll have to agree to disagree on this one Nextlevel. In my opinion - if you're feet are not in the proper position - there is no way you can hit a proper stroke. But if you've found a way to do that might want to teach it.
I linked the Khank Jha - video because they are about the same age and in my opinion Jha has very good movement and good stroke mechanics - thought would be a good example of proper form and technique. 
 
No one is always on time to do the proper stroke - the key is to (intuitively) understand the physics of  generating racket head speed, ball point contact theory and good timing to produce the contact you need when you are late to the ball (as a looper especially).  The proper stroke is the ideal for when you get to the ball on time or when you are not forced to move to the ball - the less than ideal stroke should retain what elements of the proper stroke are necessary to stay in the rally because depending on the opponent, that might just be enough!  A good shot doesn't have to be a hard hit shot - it could be a ball with sidespin or a slow ball that one can misread the amount of the spin on the ball and put it in the net or off the table.  Because the OP doesn't topspin, he doesn't have the touch to produce such balls when he is out of position.
 
The gap between Kanak Jha's level of play and the OP may not be bridged in 4 years of daily training if it can be bridged in a lifetime.  When you show a lower level player a higher level player, they tend to look at all the wrong things unless they have achieved a level of play where they are ready for what is missing.  The OP is so far away from that level of play that what you are pointing out might just confuse him. Pushblocker is 2300 so even pushblocker's level of play will confuse the OP (as it confuses many on this website who just don't understand it).  I play a 1900-2000 level penhold push blocker in my club whose game is built around heavy spin reversal so I appreciate what it takes to play that game, even though I am sure there are nuances to Pushblocker's game that I may miss because I don't fully get it.


Edited by NextLevel - 04/18/2014 at 11:54am
I like putting heavy topspin on the ball...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 12:11pm
Here is shay2be, who is your age and a junior I think you can more realistically emulate.  He has one of the best forehands I have seen for his level of experience - he has been playing for about 2-3 years (complete beginner to his current level) and he is about USATT 2000 (people believe his forehand is more advanced than that).  His footwork is nothing close to as advanced as Kanak and neither are his strokes.  I wouldn't expect you to play like him in a year, but it is possible with the right coaching.  If you are't trying to do strokes like this off both sides now, you will never get there in 2 years.
 
He is looping against chop so his stroke is more vertical but he can counter topspin with a similar but more horizontan stroke while generating his own topspin.
 
Finally, in order to make shay2be slightly more humble, I posted the set he lost ;).
 


Edited by NextLevel - 04/18/2014 at 12:15pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kurokami Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 12:33pm
Originally posted by ByeByeAbout ByeByeAbout wrote:

thanks for the upload

about 600-700 canadian (which is about 1700 american)

regards
rick

not in the tristate area lol. they'd be around 1100-1300 USATT. and there's some discrepancies in canadian system at the lower levels bc it scales up quickly where chen hongtao is 3807 and wang zhen is 3952. i beat 1700's from canada easily when i was 1400.

*oh. just saw the conversion.


Edited by kurokami - 04/18/2014 at 12:40pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 12:36pm
Finally, here is me playing an 1800 level junior.  My opponent did two things well - serve underspin (the lefty serve gives me the spin I hate the most and for some reason, I was having trouble looping that serve) and challenge my movement.  But my point is still that the main reason I got better at dealing with such players was that I learned how to play a quality ball.  Not because I move better.  I translated more of my stroke into spin and improved my balance.  But my mobility and footwork are still as bad as they were when I was 1200 - but the strokes are far more advanced.
 
 
I like putting heavy topspin on the ball...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 12:46pm
To show that this is largely about strokes, a match that I never post... I didn't even record it...
 
I like putting heavy topspin on the ball...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Whang Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 12:54pm
You'd have a way better game if you fixed your footwork to be honest..
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 1:02pm
Originally posted by davidwhang davidwhang wrote:

You'd have a way better game if you fixed your footwork to be honest..
Sure, and damaged my knees far more in the process (both are bone on bone right now, pretty much).  I gained 500 points with improved strokes.  Not improved footwork.  Any footwork that came with those strokes came in part because I understood what to do to the ball when I got to it and how to set up myself to make my stroke.
 
Why not post your video with your sterling footwork? 
 
The bottom line is that when you are not a junior with lots of time to dedicate to the game or you weren't drilled daily as a child, footwork is hard to learn.  Work on your stroke.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Whang Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 1:08pm
Originally posted by NextLevel NextLevel wrote:

Originally posted by davidwhang davidwhang wrote:

You'd have a way better game if you fixed your footwork to be honest..
Sure, and damaged my knees far more in the process (both are bone on bone right now, pretty much).  I gained 500 points with improved strokes.  Not improved footwork.  Any footwork that came with those strokes came in part because I understood what to do to the ball when I got to it and how to set up myself to make my stroke.
 
Why not post your video with your sterling footwork? 
 
The bottom line is that when you are not a junior with lots of time to dedicate to the game or you weren't drilled daily as a child, footwork is hard to learn.  Work on your stroke.


Yeah, I agree with you. My point is that working on your stroke will only improve your game up to a certain degree, NOT that it doesn't work.

Besides, when did I ever claim to have sterling footwork?

Anyway, for the OP, yes, strokes are important and footwork is equally important. As NextLevel said, you're still a "junior" with lot's of time to improve your game. Why not work on both, right?


Edited by davidwhang - 04/18/2014 at 1:10pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 1:18pm
By working on his stroke, his footwork will largely follow. The video he posted shows signs of good footwork. He moves his feet into optimal position for weight transfer for strokes to a degree higher than his level. Whether that is the moat efficient way for him to play is another question.

Edited by NextLevel - 04/18/2014 at 1:19pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Whang Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 1:23pm
Originally posted by NextLevel NextLevel wrote:

By working on his stroke, his footwork will largely follow.



And here we disagree. You don't develop good footwork just subconsciously...that's why a lot of sports like basketball, volleyball, badminton, tennis, and table tennis have drills for strokes and separately for footwork. You can work on them separately and intentionally and eventually they'll get integrated. That takes practice too - integrating them together.


Edited by davidwhang - 04/18/2014 at 1:24pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jrscatman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 1:31pm
Nextlevel,
After seeing your video - I understand your point of view. However, the OP is not tall as you are, doesn't have your knee problems. So I don't think your advice is appropriate for him. 

I think it's best to develop good habits as early as you can. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 1:33pm
Originally posted by davidwhang davidwhang wrote:

Originally posted by NextLevel NextLevel wrote:

By working on his stroke, his footwork will largely follow.



And here we disagree. You don't develop good footwork just subconsciously...that's why a lot of sports like basketball, volleyball, badminton, tennis, and table tennis have drills for strokes and separately for footwork. Work on them separately and intentionally.


Yes, you get a higher level of footwork if you practice footwork drills. However, to improve your stroke, you need to improve your racket head speed. To make your stroke smaller and recover quicker, weight transfer and balance become issues. Getting into position in time to make the stroke is also an issue. Those all fees into your footwork even if you never explicitly practice it. The question is one of degree. The improved stroke will make you go.to the next level where you have to address footwork as long as you can't blow people off the table.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Whang Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 1:33pm
Originally posted by jrscatman jrscatman wrote:

Nextlevel,
After seeing your video - I understand your point of view. However, the OP is not tall as you are, doesn't have your knee problems. So I don't think your advice is appropriate for him. 

I think it's best to develop good habits as early as you can. 


Agreed..btw, what happened to your knees, NL?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 1:43pm
Originally posted by jrscatman jrscatman wrote:

Nextlevel,
After seeing your video - I understand your point of view. However, the OP is not tall as you are, doesn't have your knee problems. So I don't think your advice is appropriate for him. 

I think it's best to develop good habits as early as you can. 


I wish I had video of the top junior in my club. His footwork and work ethic are terrible and may keep him from the top of the game. But he plays at a 2100 level because of his ability to drive underspin, no spin and topspin on his forehand as well as good serves. I may be overdoing my polemic against footwork but I do so because too many amateurs obsess over it when they can't even deliver a decent topspin. You seem to be falling into that trap too. Don't confuse what is required for a player to get better with what it takes to develop a top junior player with world class potential.

Edited by NextLevel - 04/18/2014 at 1:47pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 1:44pm
Originally posted by davidwhang davidwhang wrote:

Originally posted by jrscatman jrscatman wrote:

Nextlevel,
After seeing your video - I understand your point of view. However, the OP is not tall as you are, doesn't have your knee problems. So I don't think your advice is appropriate for him. 

I think it's best to develop good habits as early as you can. 


Agreed..btw, what happened to your knees, NL?
Various forms of arthritis.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Whang Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 1:46pm
I see..good thing you still press on to play! Nice hits btw.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VictorK Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 1:50pm
Originally posted by NextLevel NextLevel wrote:

By working on his stroke, his footwork will largely follow. The video he posted shows signs of good footwork. He moves his feet into optimal position for weight transfer for strokes to a degree higher than his level. Whether that is the moat efficient way for him to play is another question.


I disagree.   Footwork: proper/timely movement; proper feet position, weight transfer, etc are actually components and/or pre-requisite of correct stroke ... hence, should be taught in tandem.

I actually find it much easier to learn/teach most strokes starting from footwork and ending with arm movement rather than the other way around.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 1:50pm
Originally posted by davidwhang davidwhang wrote:

I see..good thing you still press on to play! Nice hits btw.


Thanks. I don't think TT will last forever but I got much further than I thought I ever would.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jrscatman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 2:04pm
Originally posted by NextLevel NextLevel wrote:

Originally posted by jrscatman jrscatman wrote:

Nextlevel,
After seeing your video - I understand your point of view. However, the OP is not tall as you are, doesn't have your knee problems. So I don't think your advice is appropriate for him. 

I think it's best to develop good habits as early as you can. 


I wish I had video of the top junior in my club. His footwork and work ethic are terrible and may keep him from the top of the game. But he plays at a 2100 level because of his ability to drive underspin, no spin and topspin on his forehand as well as good serves. I may be overdoing my polemic against footwork but I do so because too many amateurs obsess over it when they can't even deliver a decent topspin. You seem to be falling into that trap too. Don't confuse what is required for a player to get better with what it takes to develop a top junior player with world class potential.
Had to look up 'polemic'....nice one! 
I used to swing with my arms rather than using the legs and body. Now, I am trying to do it "correctly" using the legs and body - it take a little getting used to, but I believe I can generate much better shots. Provided I can keep my body relaxed through the stroke. Not always successful, especially in league matches - close games have to catch myself going to the arm method. 

But I think the OP has some good advice  and various opinions in thread, also some samples of how various people do it. Have fun and good luck. 

NextLevel - with your knee problems have considered a hitting/blocking style such as Hei Zhe Wen? Would think that would much easier on knees.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jrscatman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 2:07pm
Originally posted by VictorK VictorK wrote:

Originally posted by NextLevel NextLevel wrote:

By working on his stroke, his footwork will largely follow. The video he posted shows signs of good footwork. He moves his feet into optimal position for weight transfer for strokes to a degree higher than his level. Whether that is the moat efficient way for him to play is another question.


I disagree.   Footwork: proper/timely movement; proper feet position, weight transfer, etc are actually components and/or pre-requisite of correct stroke ... hence, should be taught in tandem.

I actually find it much easier to learn/teach most strokes starting from footwork and ending with arm movement rather than the other way around.
Agree 100%! Thumbs Up
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NextLevel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 2:07pm
Originally posted by VictorK VictorK wrote:

Originally posted by NextLevel NextLevel wrote:

By working on his stroke, his footwork will largely follow. The video he posted shows signs of good footwork. He moves his feet into optimal position for weight transfer for strokes to a degree higher than his level. Whether that is the moat efficient way for him to play is another question.


I disagree.   Footwork: proper/timely movement; proper feet position, weight transfer, etc are actually components and/or pre-requisite of correct stroke ... hence, should be taught in tandem.

I actually find it much easier to learn/teach most strokes starting from footwork and ending with arm movement rather than the other way around.


I would be really surprised if this applied to adult players with existing skills. I don't have your level of play or experience, but I spent four months with a 2200 coach who could not get me to play much better and then worked for 2 years with someone lower rated that did. The difference was that one of them wanted to show you how to hit a ball that would give your opponent fits while the other was happy just rallying and multiballing until the hour was over.

The one who improved my game believed that while top level players used all parts of their body, the wrist was the key if you wanted to play a less physical form of the top level game. When he teaches juniors, he emphasises everything, but for adults, he focuses on the stroke because as he says, if you get to the ball but don't have the right stroke, it won't matter.

He has had success improving the games of adults because he improved mostly in adulthood. Most high level coaches simply try to teach people exactly what they learned as juniors. In his case, he had an eye for what higher level players were doing to make their strokes more powerful and simply takes whatever you are doing and tries to make it better unless it is simply terrible.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VictorK Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 4:21pm
Originally posted by NextLevel NextLevel wrote:

Originally posted by VictorK VictorK wrote:

Originally posted by NextLevel NextLevel wrote:

By working on his stroke, his footwork will largely follow. The video he posted shows signs of good footwork. He moves his feet into optimal position for weight transfer for strokes to a degree higher than his level. Whether that is the moat efficient way for him to play is another question.


I disagree.   Footwork: proper/timely movement; proper feet position, weight transfer, etc are actually components and/or pre-requisite of correct stroke ... hence, should be taught in tandem.

I actually find it much easier to learn/teach most strokes starting from footwork and ending with arm movement rather than the other way around.


I would be really surprised if this applied to adult players with existing skills. I don't have your level of play or experience, but I spent four months with a 2200 coach who could not get me to play much better and then worked for 2 years with someone lower rated that did. The difference was that one of them wanted to show you how to hit a ball that would give your opponent fits while the other was happy just rallying and multiballing until the hour was over.

The one who improved my game believed that while top level players used all parts of their body, the wrist was the key if you wanted to play a less physical form of the top level game. When he teaches juniors, he emphasises everything, but for adults, he focuses on the stroke because as he says, if you get to the ball but don't have the right stroke, it won't matter.

He has had success improving the games of adults because he improved mostly in adulthood. Most high level coaches simply try to teach people exactly what they learned as juniors. In his case, he had an eye for what higher level players were doing to make their strokes more powerful and simply takes whatever you are doing and tries to make it better unless it is simply terrible.


I wholeheartedly agree that coaches should discuss with, and adjust to the goals, age and physical limitations of their students, so there's no argument here.

IMO, one of the main problems in coaching adults with existing (self-taught) skills is that they need to first "unlearn" the old/incorrect habits before re-learning the correct way, so it typically takes much longer than learning from scratch.   Some adult players and their coaches are happy building on top of old/bad habits, which might result in faster progress in short-term, but inhibits progress in the longer-term.   I don't think it's a wrong approach, as long as this is the student's objective.

I believe that with juniors, as well as with adult players who have longer-term goals and aim much higher, we need to put lots of emphasis on correct and efficient footwork.   I'm not saying that adult players should learn textbook perfect technique, but learning few, basic principles can have huge impact on their long-term progress.  Also, good footwork helps prevent injuries while giving players better, more intense workout.

Regarding your statement "if you get to the ball but don't have the right stroke, it won't matter" I would say that it's possible to hit the ball even with a wrong arm/wrist movement, but  if you don't get to the ball with your feet, then you won't be able to hit it at all - you'll swing in the air.  

Also, if you learn proper footwork and balance, you can use almost identical stroke while placing the ball in different locations and with different amount of power, while incorrect footwork (e.g. having feet always parallel to the table) will force you to alter your stroke significantly depending on where you want to place the ball and will inhibit your power and quick recovery into ready position.


Edited by VictorK - 04/18/2014 at 4:25pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Lestat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04/18/2014 at 4:23pm
Footwork is way overrated at intermediate level. Not saying it's not important, but most people can't even do a simple but precise forehand/backhand transfer and they're worried about footwork?

An amateur player with no dreams of becoming a regional champion should worry first about the stroke itself and the micro footwork that comes with it. Macro footwork should only come into the picture much later, if ever.


  


Edited by Lestat - 04/18/2014 at 4:35pm
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