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What is my level?? |
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ball_so_hard 
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Joined: 09/27/2012 Location: New Jersey Status: Offline Points: 68 |
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 Topic: What is my level??Posted: 10/07/2012 at 9:53am |
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I beat people higher than me, and lose to people lower. how can i change this bad habit? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x0ZXzoQnvBs&feature=plcp watch and like please, thanks :)
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chopchopslam
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Joined: 09/28/2011 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 703 |
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 11:13am |
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Which player are you? If you often lose to lower ranked players, your game must have some weaknesses and the other player is out-strategizing you.
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Butterfly Grubba Pro
Tenergy 80 National Team Pogo LP .6mm |
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megaspin01
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 11:14am |
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for allen: your strokes are great. your timing is a bit late often on fh. you also stand too straight. against a strong player, low fast drives, short ball placement, combination chop and drive would give you a lot of trouble.
kevin needs to improve his strokes. majority were problems with technique: sliding off the ball to the side on fh, no spin on bh when needed, tensing up when allen attacks. he has better serve and push though |
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Baal
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 11:41am |
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I'm not sure which one you are on the video. Slippery floors make it hard to see you move, but that's not your fault. On a slippery floor, sometimes it pays to take just a little bit off your opening loops and make sure you land it, since I noticed too many third balls being missed. Just from the outside, one thing seemed pretty clear to me that could be fixed fairly easily -- both of you could develop some shorter (and ideally more deceptive) serves, and getting into the habit of attacking long serves. People spend so much time learning to loop and counter and never work on their serves and returns, but that is where so many points can be won and lost. Both of you are passively pushing back what are pretty obviously bad serves you could be attacking. You don't have to rip them at full speed, but you could do more with them.
Of course it's easy to be a critic! But you wanted some constructive advice so this is what I can offer with the best of wishes. Clearly you have the technique to attack those serves, you're just not in the habit of doing it. It's a mental thing. Edited by Baal - 10/07/2012 at 12:31pm |
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cmetsbeltran15
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Joined: 01/16/2006 Location: (ง ͠ ͠° ل͜ °)ง Status: Offline Points: 2427 |
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 11:45am |
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2412 level after next ratings update. would've been 2467 level if you beat zongqi noob
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Stoi
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Joined: 09/09/2006 Location: Greece Status: Offline Points: 303 |
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 12:13pm |
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Your short game is surprisingly bad for your level. You have good footwork and technique. I think the very fast equipment you use makes the problem worse - what are you playing with by the way? I dont know who you are but both players have weak short game with black being a bit better. The serves seem to be somewhat high and semi-long which is not good. Most serves could be rocketed away but instead were pushed. Work on the serves, receives near the net, flicks and opening loops. These are the most important things. Maybe getting slower rubbers could help too. About beating lower level players most important i think is psychology. You have to play without the fear of loosing to a player worse than you and not underestimate him. Thats all i can say from the few minutes video i watched. I guess you dont have a coach or ... you are not listening to him |
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frogger
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 12:31pm |
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Very good loops and power play but as stated above short game is lacking. My rating is lower than yours but I can spot a weakness in a second. I'm 63 . I also feel going to a bit slower set up would benefit your overall game. Work on blocking and service rturn ( some balls returned to high), and opening loop with placement. Just my humble 2 cents.
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Wood Paddle
Red side Black side. |
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takethat
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Joined: 07/01/2009 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 237 |
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 1:05pm |
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We are interested in buying a table like yours. What type was that, and from whom was it purchased?
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sharkcard
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ball_so_hard
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Joined: 09/27/2012 Location: New Jersey Status: Offline Points: 68 |
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 1:25pm |
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Thanks for the consideration, I'll practice more short game from now on. I am joola sponsered and use Flame Extreme with Rhyzm.
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Carryboy
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 1:32pm |
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You need to improve your short game to move your opponent around the table in order to set up a first attack. Watching the video you tend to attack some return shots that are near impossible to attack and a simple push would have sufficed to set up a kill shot. Try looping to set up the finishing point and not looping all the time to finish the point.
LUV the table!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
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Spin Master Carbo Power (Stefan Elsner Custom)
Donic Acuda S1 Max Donic Acuda P1 Blue Max |
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hookumsnivy
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Joined: 11/04/2010 Location: Syracuse, NY Status: Offline Points: 1599 |
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 2:08pm |
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I'm curious to know the level of the people giving advice.
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Carryboy
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 2:23pm |
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hookumsnivy; I wonder why you are asking that question???
I am a typical journeyman that play table tennis for the love of the game. I really have no rating but based on the people who I play everyday and those in between I am around 1700+ and depending on the day (If my brain and my body is in sync, 50 years of age in two weeks) quite a bit higher. I typically practice/play 2-4 hours per day everyday for the last three years and I have never had a coach. I played a lot of TT in school (9 - 19) in Jamaica and stopped when I started college and found girls and cars a lot more interesting. I took up the game again in 2003 Edited by Carryboy - 10/07/2012 at 2:24pm |
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Spin Master Carbo Power (Stefan Elsner Custom)
Donic Acuda S1 Max Donic Acuda P1 Blue Max |
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hookumsnivy
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 2:34pm |
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I am wondering for a very simple reason. Allen is rated over 2300 and has a coach. While I didn't see anything wrong w/ what people were saying, I'm curious what they are basing it on. Playing at that level is very different than playing at the lower levels. If I had to guess, the average rating on this board is around 1600 and you can get away with a lot more at that level than at Allen's level.
That is not to say that a lower level player can't see things that could help. There's a big difference between knowing and doing.
Having seen both of those players before, I don't think either of them played nearly as well as they could. |
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Carryboy
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 2:48pm |
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"Having seen both of those players before, I don't think either of them played nearly as well as they could".
I have never seen them play before but by looking at them I totally agree with you. |
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Spin Master Carbo Power (Stefan Elsner Custom)
Donic Acuda S1 Max Donic Acuda P1 Blue Max |
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BizLawProf
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Joined: 07/06/2012 Location: U.S. Status: Offline Points: 277 |
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 2:55pm |
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I'm rated about 1100 USATT, been playing since the start of the year. Any of you 2000+ players want some advice? Would be glad to give it. LOL
Reminds me of what I often saw when I was a fairly serious tournament golfer: husbands who couldn't break 90 for 18 holes on their best day giving their wives advice. They'd get them tied almost into knots. I could shoot pretty consistent mid-70s for 18, sometimes break par and get down into the high 60s. Yet I seldom gave anyone advice except "slow your swing down", "stop trying to be a hero, just keep the thing in play", and the like. And almost never unless it was specifically solicited from me. I wasn't a pro or a great student of the game, just a good (but not great) player. Very few are all that much qualified to give advice to a top player (or any player) except on a very basic level. |
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Carryboy
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 3:02pm |
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+1, I could not have said it better. |
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Spin Master Carbo Power (Stefan Elsner Custom)
Donic Acuda S1 Max Donic Acuda P1 Blue Max |
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Baal
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 3:58pm |
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I am well over 2000 but not 2300. On the other hand, I play fairly regularly with guys in the 2300-2600 range -- like today -- and I see guys at that level every single day I go to my club, so I have a basis for comparison. Allen and Kevin were brave enough to post videos of themselves playing and asked for advice, even though they have very nice games already, and three different people noted the same thing. Go ahead and count how many of their serves would have come out long if they had not been pushed back passively! Almost every one in that video! Young players at this level with quick feet can do better than that, these are just bad habits that can be corrected. That said, short game is not the easiest thing to work on, you need a lot of patience and a coach able to feed lots of the kinds of balls and high level serves needed to improve. More than that, practicing it is just not so exciting -- but it is also one of the most obvious differences between 2300 players and 2500 players. Eric Owens once told me that I needed to take a month playing matches and not caring if I win or lose, but during that entire month, or better yet two months, I was supposed to work on only one thing: if a serve had even a slight chance of coming out long, I needed to attack the return.
On a completely different topic, I've played on those kinds of tables before, they are a bit slicker on the surface than some of the other brands, so the balls tends to slide a bit and bounces a bit lower. It's worth mentioning. Edited by Baal - 10/07/2012 at 5:26pm |
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BizLawProf
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 5:21pm |
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Thanks!  |
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Mahmood
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 5:38pm |
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The ball bounces too high, if a higher-rated was there, all these high balls were smashed... Rather easily.
I noticed, the rubber of the gray T-shirt player is oxidized, the black forehand rubber. The black T-shirt guy, I think his rubbers are to bouncy for his control. I seriously think, as a personal experience, that fast rubbers and fast blades wont make you any good of a player, wont let you level up. I, at the beginning, was using a very fast-stiff blade with very fast rubbers, both on backhand and forehand, thinking it's good and will level me up. But, the minute I changed my set up, I leveled up and my coach was so impressed and happy. Almost all the great players we see now are using ALL+ to OFF- equipment. Zhang jike uses viscaria (off-, slow, flexible) with H3 that is slow, only on the backhand T64. Ma Lin uses his name blade (off-, slow, flexible) with h2 that is slow. Wang hao, his name blade (off-, slow, flexible) with H3 on forehand and Sriver on backhand. Jan Ove Waldner, his name blade (off-, slow, flexible) with X1 platin and x2 platin soft. Appelgren from sweden still plays with an ALL blade. And so on... I think that is why Ovtcharov cannot compete with Zhang Jike and Ma Long. His equipment is too fast, and makes his game very messy and unorganized. For example, I was watching yesterday the olympics matches. Try to watch when Ma Long played with Ovtcharov, or when Zhang Jike faced him... Ovtcharov looked very messy and with no strategy. That is because the chinese pay great attention, may be only, to the basic strokes (forehand right/left, backhand right/left and footwork), while Ovtharov tries so much to play every single shot with a very complicated spin, speed and angle. That is simply useless when you play with someone who is excelently consistent in basic shots and is fast doing them. Anyhow, I honestly blv the players on this video played an awesome game. Bravo guys, keep up the good work.
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Bty Zhang Jike (fl 85gm)
FH: 729 transced (red max) BH: BlueFire M1 (black Max) |
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Leshxa
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 6:22pm |
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+1 It is very important to understand who you are giving advice to. Different players depending on their level will have a totally different game, and the advice is not always the right one. You're watching two very skilled players play. They don't just throw the ball over the net without thinking. They have specific reasons on why they use a certain shot vs another shot. For example, they don't try to push short not because they can't!!! Both can push short, but short pushing a serve will only yield to a short push on return ( a short push on return is not comfortable and also allows the opponent to return a short push with a long push, cramping the player to produce a weak opening shot ), which is very disadvantageous at that level - having to play cat and mouse for position. It is best to push quickly and long to force the opponent to attack the ball on the run or late - which means a slower spiny loop. This will create a better opportunity to win a point since at this level, these players are very good at countering and killing a spiny ball. This also why you don't see too many long serves - they get killed. This is exactly why its important to understand the high level game. You don't have to play one to give good advice, but you must really understand how the points are constructed at that level and what skills these high level players have mastered. Edited by Leshxa - 10/07/2012 at 6:25pm |
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Back to table tennis...
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Leshxa
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 6:24pm |
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Sorry double post.
Edited by Leshxa - 10/07/2012 at 6:24pm |
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Back to table tennis...
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Tinykin
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 6:39pm |
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I watched about 6 minutes. Both players were struggling with each others' game. That wall looked very close for comfort which seemed to affect their approach.
What short game are some talking about? All I saw were all big attacking serves and banging 3rd ball. Maybe things changed later. But while their strokes were competent, they looked very short on experience.
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Blade:
Darker Speed90 Rubber Fh and Bh DHS Hurricane 3, 39/38deg Delusion is an asset |
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blahness
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 6:42pm |
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The guy in black looks like Kim Min Seok when he plays, smooth controlled relaxed(even his looks!), I hope I can one day play like you!
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Viscaria FH: Hurricane 8-80 BH: D05 Back to normal shape bats :( |
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Stoi
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 6:50pm |
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I am curious to know why are you curious about our level. You could understand roughly our level from our advices. I believe criticizing every given advice should be made based on its validity. At this video it is very easy to spot the problems from the first couple of minutes and they are big. If i am not mistaken it has to be an important match because of the many unforced errors and bad psychology from both sides. I would like to see more matches cause if you are sponsored and have a coach this doesn't match your - poor - performance in the game you uploaded. I would suggest you to get thinner sponge maybe or even better switch to other max, like i suppose you have now, slower rubbers. |
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Stoi
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 7:27pm |
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@Lexsha I don't know what these players know about tactics and what shots have mastered but the second time i watched the video i understood even more they are playing very scared and i don't think they have a good reasoning behind most of their shots. Vast majority of the balls "ready to kill" where wasted with a weak not well placed push. They'd better have pimples and flat hit or chop instead of pushing like that with their ultra offensive setup. I hope you won't take it offensively guys, i have some to little experience on how anxiety can ruin your game and i believe that was the case here. Along with your short game work your psychology too even more. |
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ball_so_hard
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 9:27pm |
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I am the one in the black
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ball_so_hard
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 9:30pm |
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Thanks for the advice! It means alot, I appreciate it.
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ball_so_hard
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 9:32pm |
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Thank you! I dont use very fast equipment, probably slower than yours. Lol, I use Joola Flame Fast and rhyzm.
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cmetsbeltran15
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Joined: 01/16/2006 Location: (ง ͠ ͠° ل͜ °)ง Status: Offline Points: 2427 |
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 9:33pm |
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Thank you... I found it very interesting to find these 1300-1600s giving advice to someone on the verge of 2400/2450
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power7
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Posted: 10/07/2012 at 9:52pm |
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Depends if this was an important match or just a practice match...but that wall is too close.
RH player closer to the camera can't slide to their BH to make a quick FH attack. RH player away from the camera can't go too far to their FH either. Do you find yourself going easy on people lower level than you? And going harder on people higher level than you? I guess pretend everyone is higher level than you...
 Edited by power7 - 10/07/2012 at 9:54pm |
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DHS PG-7, H3 Neo, 729-5
Butterfly Power-7, Red TG2 Neo 39degree, Black Donic Bluefire M1 |
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BizLawProf wrote: