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Full match (short form) |
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seguso 
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Joined: 03/24/2010 Location: Italy Status: Offline Points: 1619 |
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 Topic: Full match (short form)Posted: 04/09/2015 at 3:31am |
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Hi guys, I realized it's been a couple of years since I last took a video of me playing, so yesterday I took one with my phone during training:
https://youtu.be/Eu1otlKbXX0 Please don't be scared that we are playing in a DUNGEON! :) it's actually a church basement. this is not a highlight; it's full match (actually two full matches) in short form. Doing this video, I was hoping to realize what I am doing wrong. And I think I have spotted some problems. Your impressions? Consider my sparring beats me most of the time, but this time he has missed more than usual, as he was out of shape and was trying a new rubber on bh (s1 instead of s2). Though it may not look like it, he has very spinny and powerful opening loops; both fh and bh; you don't block this guy if he starts first. Pushing the receive long with him is nearly certain death. (But you don't see this in the video because I don't do it). And he has good flip and short receive, so that's usually a big problem if you serve short (but yesterday as I said he was missing more). ranking: me: currently #213 Italy. opponent: he reached #135 Italy three months ago. (he was playing much better then) equipment: me: clipper wood wrb, fh: m1 max , bh: jp03 2.0. Opponent: nittaku redshank, fh: m1 turbo max , bh: s1 2.0 (testing, usually plays with s2. the test didn't go well: his bh drive, flip and block suffered). I am the short guy in the video. we played with celluloid balls. Edited by seguso - 04/09/2015 at 6:12am |
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pg5x - mxd fh & bh - 2015 video
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seguso
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Joined: 03/24/2010 Location: Italy Status: Offline Points: 1619 |
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Posted: 04/10/2015 at 7:24am |
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pg5x - mxd fh & bh - 2015 video
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Tommy16
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Joined: 01/13/2009 Location: Europe Status: Offline Points: 745 |
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Posted: 04/10/2015 at 9:30am |
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Thank you for sharing this with us. You have nice and solid William Henzel type of technique. One thing I spotted as a fh orientate player is that you could try to use your legs and torso more with your fh. Your loop your fh mainly with your hand and since you have a nice touch and good rallying skills you could try to develope a bit mor lethal fh. Very nice video!
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What is the point of playing safe shots when you can miss with style
My feedback: http://www.mytabletennis.net/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=67171&KW=&PID=811763&title=tommy16-feedback#811763 |
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Victor_the_cleaner
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Joined: 12/26/2014 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 1428 |
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Posted: 04/10/2015 at 9:52am |
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this place is kind of cool, i like it.
You game is alright, you are much better than I thought you were and much better than me. For recreational middle aged white dude.. i don't know how far you can go from here. I say don't sweat too much and enjoy. You have nice place and nice opponents so you must be having fun. If i have to say something for your game.. your paddle is always pointing to the ceiling, which reduces your backswing and consequently the quality of your shot, particularly BH opening loop where you only rotate the entire arm from the shoulder.
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NextLevel
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Joined: 12/15/2011 Location: Somewhere Good Status: Offline Points: 14842 |
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Posted: 04/10/2015 at 11:15am |
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Seguso, it's okay to show off - you have improved a lot and it shows. We play fairly similar styles so I have little to contribute. Your power and mostly arm forehand without body is decent but your control forehand not so much. But you would probably beat me easily regardless. Your biggest improvement (as is always the case at that level) is your serve and receive. And I am not at a level to poke holes at them on camera.
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I like putting heavy topspin on the ball...
Cybershape Carbon FH/BH: H3P 41D. Lumberjack TT, not for lovers of beautiful strokes. No time to train... |
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seguso
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Joined: 03/24/2010 Location: Italy Status: Offline Points: 1619 |
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Posted: 04/12/2015 at 6:16am |
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Thanks a lot for all the suggestions guys. Here's what I think.
It does not show a lot in the video because the guy almost never pushes the receive long, but I think I have some margin for improvement in third ball, where my footwork is wrong so that I can't usually kill the third ball with my fh. But I am just starting to understand the problem: wrong legs technique. I think after service I must 1) immediately fall down with my legs a lot wider. (I don't think it's a torso rotation problem) so that I am lower; and 2) then, when actually hitting, the power must come from the right leg, but this leg must not only exercise its power forward, but forward and upwards at the same time (so that the left leg lifts slightly from the ground when hitting). So I think it's a legs problem, not a torso problem. Illustration of the problem: https://youtu.be/dBMqj0CN7XU?t=3m10s. see this third ball: it is weak. and look at the legs: they are both touching the ground when I hit. This is a clue that power is not coming from the right leg. And here is where I think I do it right (though it's not a third ball, it's the same principle): https://youtu.be/dBMqj0CN7XU?t=1m59s. Here notice that the left leg is slightly lifted, because the right leg is pushing forward and upwards. So now I am working on this. --- Also, my service can be improved a lot. in particular, I think during serve my legs must be wider, so that I am lower, so that after serve I am already low and with legs wide, and can do third ball properly. I must change the serve technique so that I start with my elbow touching the table -- it helps staying low during service. --- you are right of course that, apart from serve and third ball, I don't have much room for improvement. oh, and in serve receive I can't read the spin very well, but I don't know what I can do about that. And I could also improve in block, but I don't use it a lot. --- in the open game, I don't think much torso rotation is needed, and there's not time to do it either, so I don't completely get what some of you are referring to. I agree that on fh against backspin or against dead balls there is a legs problem; I don't see a torso problem. --- About the banana flip: the trick is in the rubber, jp03. with jp02 or jp01 I couldn't do that always on short heavy backspin. The ball would fall unless I flipped very confidently. (Of course, with that rubber I give up the ability to do powerful bh loops outside the table. But in bh to bh rally it's good.) Also, the blade must not be too hard. Also the grip is important: not neutral but fh oriented. (only the tip of the index finger touches the rubber, big gap below the index, and the thumb could not touch the rubber even if I wanted. (pics: http://i.gyazo.com/0140ba08e1602514a22803ae68c61142.png, http://i.gyazo.com/3947078c8bc1589decff09b75814049a.jpg , ) ). Thanks again for all the feedback :) Edited by seguso - 04/12/2015 at 6:42am |
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pg5x - mxd fh & bh - 2015 video
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Victor_the_cleaner
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Joined: 12/26/2014 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 1428 |
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Posted: 04/12/2015 at 12:03pm |
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If you get criticism from a professional coach he will find problem with all of your strokes. THey all look home made. You generally lack back swing and follow through on all strokes. I can tell you never had a coach, which makes your journey up to here even more impressive. You seem too submerged into incredibly tiny and particular details man. Almost to the point where you don't enjoy the game. Loosen up a little. Pick a ball occasionally and go all the way, i mean put some full body rotation. Everybody does it and it feels so good when you connect. You game is kind of dry and steady, you make sure you touch everything and make no mistakes and that's all. I need to play more like you but you need to play more like me: go for some good looking but low probability shots.
There. I don't know what compelled me to write this, but when I saw your incredibly long post with details that nobody will read i felt an urge to write again.
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alexcsibi
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Joined: 10/24/2009 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 81 |
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Posted: 04/12/2015 at 12:22pm |
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You could beat the guy in red if you start practicing certain things...like only a few
1. GET READY for receive after you serve!!! you just standing there after you serve admiring your serve how pretty it is....lol same applies after you return the serve!!! get ready for attacking position and WATCH THE BALL! 2. When you lopp/topspin hit the ball in front of your body and put the body in a slight forward position so the ball lands on the table 3. your bh flip is nice but after you flip jump back quick in ready position and get ready to loop or drive the ball with either fh or bh!! You start doing that and your game will improve a lot in a few months.... |
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Blade: Stiga Infinity VPS
FH: Spinart BH: Stiga Clippa |
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blahness
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Joined: 10/18/2009 Location: Melbourne Status: Offline Points: 5443 |
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Posted: 04/12/2015 at 12:52pm |
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Your BH is really good, especially the chiquita flip, it is a real killer!
 Maybe you can give us some tips on how you developed that! You also did a lot of aggressive loop winners which shows your confidence in your BH.Your problems is mainly in footwork, posture and FH. You should be more on your balls and your heels should touch the ground less. Practise "finding" the ball more with your feet rather than your hand, especially your right foot. For your posture, you need to be a bit more disciplined and don't stand up that often, keep your knees bent and body posturing forward (you should feel that your stomach is tucked in!). This should apply immediately after serve. Your FH's problem is that it is disconnected from your torso rotation. It's quite clearly visible when people look at your backswing. Contrary to what a lot of people think, the FH stroke is governed by the backswing and not the stroke itself. Your backswing determines how much energy you can impart to the stroke. Your backswing is a pure arm backswing with minimal torso rotation. While I like your efforts to keep your motion small (very practical and smart!), in fact, your arm motion is too big which makes you slow! You may not realize that, but moving your torso is way faster than moving your arm back! So with your backswing, think about using your waist rotation to bring your bat back with minimal arm motion, and then explode into the ball! Bend your legs, shift your weight to your right leg, while simultaneously turning your torso counterclockwise (imagine squeezing a wet cloth dry!). Do a few slowmos of the top CNT FH's and you will notice a very similar backswing every time, with very minimal arm movement.
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Viscaria FH: Hurricane 8-80 BH: D05 Back to normal shape bats :( |
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seguso
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Joined: 03/24/2010 Location: Italy Status: Offline Points: 1619 |
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Posted: 04/12/2015 at 1:26pm |
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@alexcsibi
I think you are spot on. especially #1 and #3. I was trying to say the same thing when I said that after service I need to fall down quickly and with my legs wider. @ Victor I actually take pleasure in refining the technique, not in letting the arm and body go loose --- which would be pointless as I don't have the correct legs technique, and I would simply miss. Yes, I never had a coach, I can see that it shows. Thanks for taking time to reply. @blahness Thanks. interesting that you think my fh arm swing is too big (and torso usage too little). I used to think my fh arm swing is very compact (except against backspin). I need to try what you say. However I am not sure what problem this is trying to solve. My fh counterloop is my strength. The problem is fh against backspin, and there I think the problem is in the legs technique. Edited by seguso - 04/12/2015 at 1:41pm |
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pg5x - mxd fh & bh - 2015 video
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seguso
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Joined: 03/24/2010 Location: Italy Status: Offline Points: 1619 |
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Posted: 04/12/2015 at 1:40pm |
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If you read my second post, I already explained that. :) there I talk about rubber and hand grip. Let me add another tip, aside from rubber and grip: (against heavy short backspin ) you must not move your arm forward but only upwards. resist the temptation to go forward. In other words: while your wrist is turning, and you are hitting the ball, your elbow must be moving upward and not forward. (The upward motion actually stars from the shoulder, and propagates to the elbow, which propagates to the hand.) At the same time as this happens, of course, the wrist is "unwinding". Finally, at the time you hit the ball, when the wrist is almost completely unwound, the blade face must not be closed (i.e. not facing down), but perpendicular to the table, or even a little bit open. otherwise you'll net the ball. and for that, the fh oriented grip is fundamental otherwise you'll always be a bit too closed. again, this techinque so described is only for flipping against heavy short backspin. and only with soft rubbers. (With hard rubbers you have to brush more, and hit with a blade face more closed. This might look easier because having a blade face more closed is easier, but is actually more difficult because, if you don't hit with a lot of power, the ball will fall down. And this in turn means your legs must be very quick, and you have less margin for error, and must have understood the serve spin perfectly.)
I had reached the same conclusion. I think the key is to keep legs wider, so as to be lower and at the same time remain quick. I stand up too much. Thanks |
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pg5x - mxd fh & bh - 2015 video
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blahness
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Joined: 10/18/2009 Location: Melbourne Status: Offline Points: 5443 |
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Posted: 04/13/2015 at 12:40pm |
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You have very good touch, which makes your counterloop quite good. But add in the legs and the torso action, and you will be generating overwhelming power and spin that you never thought was possible. This will make your FH a point winner just like your BH. With good power, underspin or topspin is no problem at all because you will always be able to generate enough spin to overpower the existing spin on the ball. |
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Viscaria FH: Hurricane 8-80 BH: D05 Back to normal shape bats :( |
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slevin
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Joined: 03/15/2012 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 3602 |
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Posted: 04/13/2015 at 12:54pm |
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Good video and very good game, seguso.
In addition to what the others have mentioned, I think a big attribute of seguso's success despite the 'weaker' attributes that Sid mentioned (softish strokes without a lot of weight / power / followthrough) is that he has almost a pro-like level of very quickly moving to a optimal spot immediately after his serve or serve-receive or stroke. His short stroke follow through certainly helps in this as well.
A bit on JP03 2.0: I noticed the ease of banana loop with it as well. On a harder blade though (I used MJ-SZLC), it simply bottoms out too quickly when you move back. It is more effective than M2, et all in banana loop because of it's soft topsheet. Other rubbers in it's vein (soft topsheets, might be good at banana loop) are Omega V Euro (a bit faster / firmer than JP03) and Rasant Grip (a bit faster / firmer than OVE). |
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Trade feedback:
http://mytabletennis.net/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=50787 |
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seguso
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Joined: 03/24/2010 Location: Italy Status: Offline Points: 1619 |
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Posted: 04/13/2015 at 1:19pm |
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Hi Slevin! Long time no see :)
Really? Hmm, honestly I think I am rather weak at that. I mean, I am definitely slow with my legs to return in the optimal spot. (I can agree that I am quick with the arm). I agree with alexcsibi on that, I need to work on that.
Yeah, when I briefly got back to M2 I was like "that's actually too hard to flip. No wonder I was missing so many flips. How could I not notice?" You tend not to realize the hardness of a rubber when you get used to it. And you don't realize this is why you are missing so many shots. Of course the opposite can be true: M2 on fh is too soft, but when I was using it I did not realize this was the reason why I couldn't powerloop against backspin. Edited by seguso - 04/13/2015 at 1:20pm |
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blahness wrote: