Review: Tuttle Beijing IV

cotdt wrote: Would this be a good backhand rubber? I'm looking for cheaper alternative to T64.

See GeneralSpecific's TB4 Review

It seems to fit his mid range backhand.

Flattening out my FH drive stroke produces a very unpleasant looking ball from the TB4. Short-pip FH users might like this one a lot.

I tried it again tonight, this time on a T-11, with a Focus 3 Snipe on the other side.  Quite a setup I must say!  Fast, but not uncontrollably so.  In fact, the BH was more controllable than T64 on my H-WN.  The spin overall wasn't great, but it's got such a good speed and it seems to be able to hit through spin quite well.  I don't think my attacking game suffered at all with this, but the short game was just awful as the T-11 is just way too quick.

bluebucket wrote: bogeyhunter, if I was your coach I'd ban you from chopping, you are far to good on the offensive to be a chopper, it's holding you back

This is a really fun rubber to play with due to the loud CRACK you get on a hard-hit ball, and the superb control it provides at speed. The easiest to use counter-looping rubber I've tried, and it's perhaps the best blocking rubber bar none, being both fast and insensitive to spin.

I was having so much fun with it warming up for last night's TT club RR that I decided to risk campaigning the new rubber in the night's tourny. Considering these were my first matches with TB4 I did better than expected, but worse than with my regular T25 bat. Missing from my game was extra spin on serve and tighter arcs on BH drives (I over-hit quite a few balls with the TB4). I also had considerable difficulty looping fast side/back serves to my FH corner, though that stroke is not one I've mastered by any means, even with my regular bat. I played one lobber and slamming his high balls with TB4 was completely effective.

In summary, I'd say that for $20 it's a fantastic buy. But for my money I'm sticking with Tenergy 25.

Is this a serious rubber with decent spin, speed and control? Can it compete with Euro/Japanese in the $40 range or is another competitor of Haifu BWII and Shark II rubbers? I can't quite get the feel of where this rubber is properly positioned.

richrf wrote: Is this a serious rubber with decent spin, speed and control? Can it compete with Euro/Japanese in the $40 range or is another competitor of Haifu BWII and Shark II rubbers? I can't quite get the feel of where this rubber is properly positioned.

I see you haven't seen my review http://mytabletennis.net/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=48175&title=video-review-tuttle-beijing-4

The spin on loops is at about tenergy 64 level and speed is a bit below tenergy 05. control on attacks is much better than both.

richrf wrote: Is this a serious rubber with decent spin, speed and control? Can it compete with Euro/Japanese in the $40 range or is another competitor of Haifu BWII and Shark II rubbers? I can't quite get the feel of where this rubber is properly positioned.

pnatchwey, I'm not sure why you think the TB4 is in a similar speed class as the H3 #19.  Now, I've never played with #19, but I've heard that it's a good bit slower than the regular H3's, and based on what I can tell, the TB4 is similar in speed to the H3/Neo, maybe even a tad faster, definitely livelier.

Finally! I was able to hit with it today. After 2-hours of rallying with a 2000 level player I conclude:

Edited by tommyzai - 03/10/2012 at 11:20pm

Just knocked around with it on my robot, on a Stiga Clipper blade. First thought was wow this rubber is loud. I mean very loud, like this will draw looks at your next practice session or tournament loud. The pop is there, can definitely unload on a shot if necessary, but the spin wasn't out of this world for a soft rubber. Good enough for me, but I could see some higher level players really wanting more spin. If you're in the market for a cheap Euro-style rubber, this is a great price-to-performance option IMO. 

Glue sheet? Oh no . . . I glued over it.

ztec wrote: pnachtwey wrote: ztec wrote: On another note: To anyone who's used this rubber already, what was the glue layer that comes on the rubber like for you? Mine was glossy and virtually non-sticky. Same here.  That is why I thought about peeling it off but so far it is working well but I put rubber cement on both the shiny glue layer and the blade.   Another post said I shouldn't need to put glue on the glue sheet. Ok glad to know it's not just me, perhaps razortt can look into this issue for us at some point. It's not a pressing matter at least. In my previous experience with H3Neo and BWII I didn't need to apply glue to the sheet, but in this case, my rubber didn't stick unless I did. I am curious if I had just dabbed on some water to the glue if it would've regained it's stickiness, perhaps I'll try that first with my second sheet of TB4 for when this one wears down.

Hi , please glue the rubber the normal way. 1 coat on the sponge and 1 coat on the blade. Even for H3NEO, we also put 1 coat on the sponge and 1 coat on the blade. Hope that clears up. Thanks!

pnachtwey wrote: dingyibvs wrote: pnatchwey, I'm not sure why you think the TB4 is in a similar speed class as the H3 #19.  Now, I've never played with #19, but I've heard that it's a good bit slower than the regular H3's, and based on what I can tell, the TB4 is similar in speed to the H3/Neo, maybe even a tad faster, definitely livelier. You may be right.  This is a problem I have with reviews where people evaluate rubber just by playing.  People are not calibrated machines.   Most of us can adapt to the rubbe so we still end up playing the same way. The truth about the speed will be evident when I start shooting ping pong balls on the rubber while it is mounted on the cutting board.

yogi_bear wrote: its because the human factor on using an equipment should never be separated and shooting pingpong balls on a a stationary rubber mounted on a board is not a good way to check the speed.

That is the only way you can remove the human factor and measure the true speed and not how people play with the rubber.   I am going to mount the rubbers on a cutting board instead of a paddle.  This way the flex of the paddle is not a factor either.  The rubber will be "on its own"

When I take a video you will be able to see which rubber is faster and spinnier by where the ball bounces as in the Pathfinderpro videos.

I am not measuring a true absolute speed but relative speed.  It should be easy to see which rubber is relatively faster than the others by where the ball bounces.

If I turn my robot head on its side the balls will hit the blade and bounce back and to the side.  This will be a good measure of "throw angle".  Balls that bounce more to the side will have a higher throw angle.  Those balls that bounce the farthest will be the 'faster' rubbers with the higher coefficient of restitution.

A radar gun would work.  There are special radar guns for sports that will measure the speed of a ball coming and going.  However, if I just want to measure relative speeds and "throw angles" then my method is good enough.

It is clear I don't trust myself to make objective evaluations let alone anybody else.  So far I have enjoyed playing with TB4 but this is subjective.  The cutting board test will be the true comparison between the rubbers but it won't change how much I have like playing with TB4.

One must evaluate the properties of the rubber independently of how it is used.
 
I am going to order a red sheet soon to go on the BH of my TBS+T05.   I keep the TBS+T05 constant but I change the BH rubber from time to time when I get bored.  At this time I have 802-40 1.8mm and Super Anti cut for my TBS.  I will add the TB4 for an inverted rubber.   I have an uncut red T05 but I will save that for when my black T05 wears out.  The red T05 would be too heavy anyway.  I want a light BH rubber.